not charging

[Guest]

Hey guys..

once again.. got a problem with my sisters little Chinese ped..

FAULT: Battery not charging.. so everything is running off battery and draining flat after a journey, resulting in riding around with no lights..

Well, i say it isnt charging...

the bike stays running if i disconnect the battery... so must be producing something right??

also, did a light bulb test to see how little, or if any power is going to the battery..

the bulb lit up a little bit, went dim, then went off.. all while engine was still running, with no battery connected..

When the bike is running, even revving it, doesnt brighten up the very dim headlight.. (which used to be extremely bright)...

I have fitted a brand new Stator, aswell as new Reg/Rec... and still the very same...

Now.. without going into a boring long story.. she had a fault quite recently.. and left the ped at her mates...

it requires some welding.. he did it.. and didnt disconnect any wiring..

Arc welded.. so resulted in frying the battery, stator and reg/rec... (which is why i replaced them)...

This charging issue, has only been an issue, since my mate Arc welded on the bike...

Along with that issue.. the fuel guage no longer functions correctly, the needle doesnt rise to the top of the guage, even if the tank is filled to the brim..

Also.. it lead to a problem with the rear light, constantly blowing bulbs.. so i was also forced to re-wire the rear light slightly.. Just so that the rear light stays on while riding.. Like constantly..

I am thinking that perhaps he has fried/damaged the wiring loom somewhere?

or do you reckon its just an unluck case of a faulty stator / regulator?? (these were brand new parts fitted)..

Sadly, due to moving house recently.. i am unable to find my multimeter or anything else, to be able to test the stator output etc..

id really like to get to the bottom of this ped..

its my little sisters transport to college daily.. Not to mention the fact that she has only had it since june.. and it has spent most of its time of her ownership, off the road..

she is lost without it..

cheers

[Grumpy Old Git]

Im thinking that perhaps he has fried/damaged the wiring loom somewhere?

 

 

YES!!!

[Guest]

To be honest.. this was the first thing that came to mind..

BUT, i wanted a second opinion..

After all, the stator and regulator might be brand new.. But new doesnt always mean that it works..

I will order in a new loom and see how we get on.

[acting_strange]

Buy a cheap multimeter first and do some checking....

[rennie]

He will have fried something!

not automatically the loom!

other electrical components would be my guess,

anything with a circuit board or transistors/diodes.

[Guest]

Well the only electrical items i can think of that could be at risk.. is the stator and reg/rec.. which were both replaced..

Also the CDI could be at risk.. But tested to be perfectly fine when i fitted it to my bike and ran it for a couple of days..

Everything works perfectly fine.. Lights, automatic enrichener etc.. Its just the charging issue, and the fuel guage not working how it should..

The fuel guage isnt all that important though, as its really easy to tell when the ped is running low on fuel.. Its a bit quicker acceleration

cheers

[Guest]

UPDATE: ordered a new wiring loom, fitted it.. All connectors are correct, and all wire colour matches perfectly..

But no No spark!!

Its not like ive never fitted a wiring loom before!!

BUt going back a few days here.. My sister and i, went for a ride.. with her being very new to riding, didnt look at road conditions up ahead, rode on some damp leaves and slid off...

I stopped to help her get back up etc.. and when she was ready, tried to start her bike up.. it started.. just took a while on the starter...

then that evening.. she went to pop out on it.. But upon starting it up, smoke came from under the speedo..

So today when fitting the new loom, i found the issue to be the reg/rec.. thats what was smoking the other night..

and in result.. the backing of the reg/rec, is all burst open and smells of burning..

I have re-checked the wiring more than 5 times all this evening.. and even held the old loom next to it to re-check for sure.. (since the new loom has a couple more connectors in places, than the stock.. which i gather is from where the loom's are used in multiple brands of bikes etc)..

and sure enough.. wiring is spot on...

but no spark....

Surely a f**ked reg/rec, wouldnt stop spark??

[Guest]

UPDATE:

Okay.. i was right in thinking, a faulty reg/rec wouldnt stop the spark..

turns out to be a wierd issue here..

the CDI box, takes 6pin connectors.. 1x 4pin, then a seperate 2pin plug..

the white/black striped wire, i know normally runs to a killswitch...

the bike wouldnt get spark, unless i disconnected that wire..

as soon as it was disconnected.. it starts up lovely...

But as soon as i put the wire back in, the engine loses spark, even with the key turned ON..

BUT.. when the wire is disconnected.. the engine will continue to run, even when the key is turned OFF...

get what i mean?? no matter what.. if the wire is connected.. NO SPARK..

Wire disconnected.. SPARK.... but engine continues to run when i remove the key...

Any ideas??

because like stated.. i know that wire is meant to go upto a killswitch.. but there is no killswitch on the bike.. in the wiring loom, the white/black striped wire from the CDI, follows upto a connector block. that has a bridging wire.. so basically, making a circuit to that wire...

Ideas???

[eastanglianbiker]

put the 2 plug wire in cut cut the wires off and run to seperate switch turn ign off then flick switch to kill engine not ideal but should work

[Joeman]

And if you plug it in when the engine is running the engine should stop.

Sounds to me like the ignition switch is bad. Possible the welding has welded the contacts closed.

[Guest]

Yeah something wasnt right..

Found a way around it now though..

Cut the wire and soldered a length of wire to it, and joined it to an earth on the ignition switch.. works just as it should do now..

My sister has been out on the bike most of the day, runs lovely.. and best of all.. there is charge!!

[Guest]

OK, back with ANOTHER issue with this ped!

Been working perfectly for the past week or so...

My sister has been using it day and night, without a glitch..

But suddenly last night.. she rode to her boyfriends, and said the lights went really dim.. so she pulled over.. Waited about 20 seconds, and everything came back to full brightness again..

and when i say lights went dim.. I mean, headlight, dash light and rear light...

(i tested this issue to be true, this evening)

I thought that perhaps the reg/rec was screwed, as it was a spare that i had sitting in a parts box...

So i took a ride to my local bike parts shop, and got a brand new one.. and the issue still persists..

When the lights go dim.. if you turn the lights off for a couple of mins or so.. the lights go back to full brightness straight away..

So its had new wiring loom, tried a new reg/rec in it.. (just incase its failing to charge battery, think that the lights may be running off battery)..

The engine had a new stator a couple of months back, when the issues first began..

Any suggestions?? As im getting rather Pee'd off with this bike.. Just want to get it sorted once and for all..

My sister isnt having a very fun time, being new into biking...

Im thinking of a couple of issues..

it could be that either. 1. the stator is defective.. as it doesnt seam to power anything properly.. even upon revving the bike, the lights dont become brighter..

But then also, in its defense.. the lights do brighten up to normal after a short time... So im umm'ing and arr'ing about it being a stator issue..

2. the battery is naff.. it was a new battery about a month back.. but with the electrics dying on her recently, its been draining the battery, to the point the lights turn off..

so i was thinking along the lines of that..

Because i recall my kymco being funny with electrics once the battery was completely screwed..

Firstly it started off, just simply not having the juice.. But revving the bike would brighten the lights up..

But in the end.. the battery was that dead.. that revving the bike actually made the lights dimmer.. due to the battery being soo naff..

so yeah. those are the two choices im really left with

[wr6133]

You have a multi meter? If not buy this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Digital-LCD-M ... 1c32dd5ce7 easier to test stuff properly than guess and replace bits.

[Guest]

yeahh ive just bought myself one mate..

really getting so fed up with all this.. and so is my little sister..

Bud sadly, due to being a college student, she has 0 funds, to save up for a new bike...

Its me and my mother that are helping out by buying new parts for it..

So will wait for this Multimeter to arrive, and check the stator out..

any idea what resistance readings i should be roughly getting? to indicate a good working stator?

Obviously if it reads 0, then there is a dead short, meaning its naff..

But what readings would you suggest, like min / max readings??

of course, there could be too high of a resistance, indicating a problem, this is why im asking, maximum "good" readings, and "too high" readings..

cheers

[wr6133]

Off the top of my head (so you may want to confirm these)

Stat - 10V AC or above (can be more if RPM high)

Reg/Rec - Around 15V DC

[Guest]

Off the top of my head (so you may want to confirm these)

Stat - 10V AC or above (can be more if RPM high)

Reg/Rec - Around 15V DC

 

10v AC??? that low??

[Guest]

Okay.. got multimeter through the post today.. and set off checking over this 'ped...

4 wire total stator.. 2x coil and 2x charge wire..

RESULTS:

ohm's test on each wire.. came up with around 1.5 - 1.6 ohm.. Which is about perfect..

ohms test from each wire to ground = 0.. which is perfect, means no shorting out..

Idling vAC from charge wires = 49 - 50.2 vAC, which i am taking a gathering is good?? most bigger bikes push out around the 70's range, so im gathering, a small 50cc engine with a small stator.. avg of 50 vAC is good..

vDC at battery engine off = 11.34v

vDC at battery engine idling = 11.01v So voltage drop to the battery while bike is running?!?

vDC at battery engine revving = 11.5 - 11.7v..........

11.7v under revving???? Something not right somewhere, couple of volts short..

Tried with all reg/rec's that i had spare... all came up with exactly same results...

So stator testing seams to be functioning correctly... But going to the battery is 2-3v (ish) short of what it should be..

Im looking towards the direction of f**ked battery here??

As remember.. this battery has been running electrics a few times and ran completely dead, to the point there is absolutely 0 emittence from any bulb..

Anyone please give a 2nd opinion??

PS: i also had a spare matching flywheel laying around, so i fitted that, due to the magnetic force inside being stronger.. Obviously, the stator requires that magnetic energy for function.. So stronger magnetic strength is obviously better.. (i tried to remove as many potential faults as possible)

cheers

[Grumpy Old Git]

With engine running (tickover) check voltage output from the rectifier / regulator. If this is not the same as you get at the battery, then there is a problem (high restance) in the cableing (could be a bad / corroded connector).

Check voltages at each connection to see where the issue is.

It still could be the stator even though it is giving a reasonable vAC output - Was this checked on load (i.e. all connected up with the battery in place? If yes, then rectifier / regulator or battery or cable integretry is suspect.

No easy answers but should be easy to find the issue.

You could couple in an alternative (good) battery as a temporary check - It does not have to be able to fit the frame housing, just extend the cableing to the bench.

[Guest]

hi GOG..

well the entire wiring loom on the whole bike is brand new.. so that rules out the cabling issue..

But will have a check of the voltages out of the reg/rec

Unfortunately i dont have a spare battery sitting around that i can use in it.. Only one being the one thats in my bike.. but to get that out, i would need to remove the electrics box and un-plug all my electrics etc

Well my sister took the ped out for a little run earlier on.. about 4-5mile ride.. came back, and the battery was sitting at 11.89v without engine running, when originally it was only 11.34v

and didnt even get close to that when revving earlier.. So thats a good sign

Looking like it may be fine..

Ive put the battery on trickle charge for the rest of the evening, give it a full charge before testing idle voltages. again, just ruling out any possibilities..

if its higher voltage now after a run.. it could well sit at 13-14v when running, on full charged battery.. Who knows.. worth a look anyway..

Basically, im seeing an improvement, simply by changing flywheel to one with more magnetic force on it.. like i said earlier.. thats what makes the electric in the coils..

the flywheel i took off, didnt have anywhere near as much magnetic force as ive seen in the past..

So perhaps that could of been it...

Will charge it fully, test it fully, for a while.. then report back

cheers

[Joeman]

Well my sister took the ped out for a little run earlier on.. about 4-5mile ride.. came back, and the battery was sitting at 11.89v without engine running, when originally it was only 11.34v

 

If after youve had it plugged into your charger for a while, it still reads less than 12v, its a dead battery,.

11.8v is basically a fully discharged battery.