Throttle Issues

[Rik398]

Ok guys, basically I have recently had a problem with my bike, which would normally cost £1800. Now, at first I thought everything was over, but now that I have had time to assess the problem, I was wondering what you guys were thinking?

Basically, I can't take it anywhere professional, it is an electrical issue, and no garage will touch it becuase the cable that connects up the diagnostic tool is not working, and they want £300 to repair that before they have even told me the problem.

Anyway, its started with the fact tt my battery went dead, and the bike therefore would not start. But, there was enough power to just about keep everything workable. I was hearing a constant clicking sound, even when the ignition was switched off, right under the tank where the throttle bodies are. Turned out to be a motor on the side that controlls the secondary butterfly system. I removed the part, and after taking it off found that it came apart quite easily. The motor inside was fairly well siezed up with gunk, so I cleaned it out and now its all freed up again, and the coils look fine, so I am expecting that to work once I replace it. (if not, the £1800 part from triumph, is infact a windscreen washer motor off of a bus, so I will be replacing it with that)

However, I went back to the bike, and there was still a ticking noise. I looked around, and after looking at the service manual, I found that the main electrical relay (which is aparanatley responsible for providing a stable current to the ECU) was completley gone, so were a few other relays on the bike.

What effect do you think replacing those will have, I can't get hold of any until the weekend, but do you folks reccon that the main electrical relay being shot may be responsible for the problems I have. I mean, it sounds so important, but is just a tiny little relay, so surley it is not that important.

Sorry for the essay folks, but I have a decission to make by monday as to whether I am keeping the bike, or accepting the fact that it has been nothing but trouble for the last few months, and swapping to a different bike.

Thanks,

[Tango]

It may only be a tiny little relay....but it has a job to do, and if it's not doing that job then that could explain the problems you have experienced. I'm guessing that a replacement relay can be had for a few quid (2nd hand) or more quids (new) and it's pretty easy to replace....so it's gotta be worth a shot....

You could sell the bike and buy something else.....but who knows if that will be any better.....maybe better off with the Devil you know?....

[Rik398]

Cheers Tango,

Yeah they do them at halfords for like a few quid, just a little relay box that seems a fairly standard component. I got a few the other day to replace the other shot ones, so I will just pick up another as soon as I can get a lift organised and see where we are.

And you have a point, it is a pain in the ass, but with all the fixing and forced avoidance of garrages due to the lack of diagnostics, I have become fairly good at fixing it cheaply. Its just electrical issues do my nut in, and in the case of this issue, it is literally a case of checking everything... every fuse and wire and a massive process of elimination. Going to be busy of the weekend.

Thanks again, I am hoping that the main electrical relay is messing up the ECU, and so the ECU is messing up the throttle bodies. But hey we shall see...

[Tango]

Yeah...the ECU doesn't control the throttle bodies....but it does alter the fuelling according to the Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) which is attached to the throttle bodies. Once you replace the relay it would be a good idea to reset the adaption....which is easy to do even if you can't hook the bike up to TuneECU. Basically, start the bike but DO NOT touch the throttle....let it idle until the fan kicks in...then still without touching the throttle let it idle for another 15mins....this will reset the running information in the ECU (adaption). When you then take the bike for a run it will then start populating the run information from scratch using information from all the sensors around the bike. This normally gets the bike running good again. The only thing it won't do is synchronize the throttle bodies....and you'd need vacuum guages to do that.

Good Luck mate.....

[Weebl]

Why do you think you have a few relays gone? relays don't generally just go, especially a few at a time without something else causing the issue.

Also, just because something is not massive and heavy does not mean it will have no effect on a bike. I had a resistor measuring about 1/4 of an inch long and weighing less than a tenth of an ounce go on my car from inside the ECU. A ton and a half of car won't move without it.

If you have several relays gone, I am surprised you did not notice before, and surprised the bike worked as well.

[Rik398]

I took the relays off, and took the plastic covering off of them. They are like a black box, and you can open them up with a screwdriver. On inspection, there is a coil, and on my relays there was a failry large black spot on the coil, and on the main electrical relay, it was full of rusty water. The bike has lived outside over this rain period, so it may be that the relays got soaked, seeing as they sit under the seat which is where water can normally collect, but that is just a theory.

What is bothering me is that if i disconnect the battery, the noise stops, but if I turn of the ignition, or even hit the kill switch, the noise continues, which to me is very strange indeed.

Also, I removed a 20 amp fuse which looks like it may be something to do with the engine. It has an engine picture above it on the fuse box. Normally when I remove a fuse, the alarm will go off. In this case, with this one particular fuse, the alarm does not go off. In addition, once the fuse is removed, the noise stops. The fuse does not look like it has blown, but there is a large dent in it on one side, perhaps it is half gone... or just worn out?

Very Strange

[Rik398]

Also with the relays... I know that one of them controlls the fan, and the fan is not really consistant as to what tempreture will cause it to kick in. And the fuelling has seemed a litlle off for the last week or so, feeling a bit jerky at times, especially in first gear. But its always been a bit like that.

[Tango]

The relay will control the power to whichever circuit.....the ignition switch only controls the relay. If the relay is tracking down to ground (via rusty water or corrosion) it could be effectively bypassing the ignition switch and kill switch. Water and electrics are not good companions....

I'm sure that replacing the relay will solve a number of issues (if not all of them)....

[Rik398]

Quick Update,

Changed the relays and a couple of fuses to be on the safe side, and it runs! and the clicking has gone On the downside, there was a fairly alarming clicking sound, which could range from something to do with the engine, all the way to the loose bunjy left hanging of the footpeg. Investigations will continue after pizza is consumed.

[Rik398]

Ok, so changed the relays that seemed to be broken, and pulled the electric motor out of the secondary butterfly controll on the throttle bodies (damn annoying job) the actual motor is off of a bus windscreen wiper, but I manages to clean it up good enough to run, as tested on an old 12v dc charger I had lying around. Stuck it all back together and the bike ran.

Sounded damn awful, I was convinced a bolt may have fallen into the engine, however, after a good half hour of idle to sort itself out, it is running better than ever.

Still not out the woods yet. Need to get the battery charged properly, start it under its own power and take it for a drive to make sure it runs ok, but so far so good.