Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Hi guys,I have a 1999 bandit 600. When it runs it if perfect...it's getting it to start that's the problem.The engine turns but won't catch and it's a new battery so that's not the problem.Sometimes it does catch but withing 15 seconds at full rev the engine dies.Now, this tends to be happening more and more the col,der and wetter it gets.The bike it kept outside (no choice) but is covered.I have tried priming the bike before use and have also tried various ammonts of choke.So....any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 It's good that you've got a good battery, but make sure all the connections (including earthing points) are clean. If they've got rust on them then it doesn't matter how good the battery is - give them a spruce up with a BRASS (not steel as that can introduce rust) wire brush. How old is the bike? Maybe the brushes in the starter motor are starting to wear out?As for not being able to start the sucker, maybe it's carb icing:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carburetor_icing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 If it was carb icing how would I fix it? Would spraying wd40 oved the carb stop the water from gathering so it couldn't ice over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 This thread on another site talks about avoiding carb icing:http://www.harley-davidson-hangout.com/ ... ution.htmlAnd this is the product they're talking abouthttp://www.whitedogbikes.com/cgi-bin/cc ... ne_PRO_FSTHalfords may have a similar product, but I can't find one on their website. I don't think spraying WD-40 on the outside of the carb will do much, apart from gather mud as carb icing occurs on the inside of the carb Like it says in that thread on the Harley site it only seems to happen just above freezing so hopefully it'll get a bit colder and you'll be OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin the Bear Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 15 seconds at full rev the engine dies. Could be your problem right there. Don't use full revs on a cold and frosty morning. The water is in the air. The faster you rev the engine the faster the air flows through the intake, cooling the intake, to the point where ice starts to build up and chokes off the air.Take it easy and let the heat build up from the engine. Make sure you thoroughly warm up the bike before setting off. As the temperature drops below freezing, the water will have been freeze dried out of the air. Dry air = no ice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 15 seconds at full rev the engine dies. Could be your problem right there. Don't use full revs on a cold and frosty morning. The water is in the air. The faster you rev the engine the faster the air flows through the intake, cooling the intake, to the point where ice starts to build up and chokes off the air.Take it easy and let the heat build up from the engine. Make sure you thoroughly warm up the bike before setting off. As the temperature drops below freezing, the water will have been freeze dried out of the air. Dry air = no ice I will try this just to be sure but am fairly certain that I don't always rev it full as it would wake the neighbours at 6am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Good point Colin. As a guide try to get it idling between 1,500 and 2,000 while it warms up. That worked OK on my 1999 GSX600F (same engine). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Getting it to idle would be a good start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin the Bear Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 New plugs is always a good start for winter. Usual routine then. Check condition of old plugs for diagnosis. Check for fuel and spark. Perhaps a different starting routine. It's very easy to flood the engine on a cold morning. The fuel air mix condenses in the combustion chamber and on the plug and wets it. At lower temperatures it's difficult to dry this out.Using no choke and no throttle, spin the engine with the button for 2 to 3 seconds. If it fires , catch it with the throttle but it probably won't at this stage. This has the advantage of freeing things up and throwing some oil round the engine.Move the choke about a third of the way and repeat. Still no throttle. If it fires catch it with the throttle. If not.Move the choke half way and repeat.If its not trying or firing up increase the choke in small increments and repeat.Even a new battery won't be giving its best at low temperatures. So the best spark comes as you let go of the start button. This split second as the engine is spinning under its own momentum and the battery is giving its full effort to the spark is when the engine is most likely to start. Therefore it's best to use the button in short bursts rather than hanging on and hoping.If you smell petrol, it's flooded. Go and put the kettle on. The only way to start it quickly is to remove the plugs, clean them and warm them on the gas cooker. Otherwise give it half an hour before you try again.It's a bit of a knack but you soon get used to the personality of the bike once you have some success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 New plugs is always a good start for winter. Usual routine then. Check condition of old plugs for diagnosis. Check for fuel and spark. Perhaps a different starting routine. It's very easy to flood the engine on a cold morning. The fuel air mix condenses in the combustion chamber and on the plug and wets it. At lower temperatures it's difficult to dry this out.Using no choke and no throttle, spin the engine with the button for 2 to 3 seconds. If it fires , catch it with the throttle but it probably won't at this stage. This has the advantage of freeing things up and throwing some oil round the engine.Move the choke about a third of the way and repeat. Still no throttle. If it fires catch it with the throttle. If not.Move the choke half way and repeat.If its not trying or firing up increase the choke in small increments and repeat.Even a new battery won't be giving its best at low temperatures. So the best spark comes as you let go of the start button. This split second as the engine is spinning under its own momentum and the battery is giving its full effort to the spark is when the engine is most likely to start. Therefore it's best to use the button in short bursts rather than hanging on and hoping.If you smell petrol, it's flooded. Go and put the kettle on. The only way to start it quickly is to remove the plugs, clean them and warm them on the gas cooker. Otherwise give it half an hour before you try again.It's a bit of a knack but you soon get used to the personality of the bike once you have some success. lol...my dad used to heat the sparkplugs off an old car of his...an Austin Princess if I remember correctly.Just out of curiosity, would a battery optimiser help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin the Bear Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 It just charges the battery and keeps it charged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissb6 Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 It could be your starting technique, or a problem with the choke circuit on the carbs. Would not advise reving a cold engine, more damage is done to a engine in not giving it the chance to warm up and lub up the motor and warm the oil , particularly with you saying your keeping it outside. Start on full choke then run up for couple of minutes on a fast tickover before trying to reving up the motor. Carb freezing these days is not common, the cooling system is now normally routed around the carb manifolds to stop this happening, so again warm the engine up before setting off. Optimate chargers are a good call this time of the year as running the bike with the lights on all the time puts a lot of strain on the battery and charging circuits, the optermate will give you the best chance of getting started.From a safty point of view, there's nothing worse or dangerous than a stuttering cold motor.Stay safe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Well...tried all mentioned above (apart from the charger) and still no luck.I cxan't actually get it to start now, nevermind tick over.Think a visit to the garage tomorrow may be in order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 i've found fresh plugs always helps with Bandit starting problems... did on my 600, my mate Ian, and JadeMongooses, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 I had it serviced about a month ago...just after I bought it and they fitted new plugs, a new battery and new chain and sprockets (I knew it was gonna need these) so I don't think it's them either.I appreciate all the advice guys...I was kinda hoping it was something I was doing wrong but it seems not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin the Bear Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 So what have you checked? You've not hit the kill switch have you.Petrol on and present Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Did they change the plugs or SAY they changed the plugs? Know what I mean I'd still check them. Could be old ones, could be wet, could need regapping or a clean up. Worth a go anyway considering how easy it is on the Bandit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Well...I've checked everything mentioned here...bar the sparkplugs which I will change tomorrow....kill switch isn't the problem and fuel is on and present.I admit...I am new to bikes and don't have a car either so my mechanical knowledge is pretty much non-existent.Guess this is the best way to learn though hey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin the Bear Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Get yourself a manual Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Here's one http://www.taylorherring.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/96_manuel.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissb6 Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 On all the carb bikes i've had, from cold all i've done is as followes:Full choke, do not touch the trottle just hit the starter button, "opening the throttle at this point is almost certain to flood the engine". The motor should start and run up on a fast idle, after a few moments you should notice the motor start to choke itself ie, the engine slows down and begines almost to splutter, at this point move the choke lever to half way and slowly blip the trottle open and continue to warm up the engine. after a few moment of this the motor should be warmed up enough to let the choke completly off, the engine should then rev up clean and run at its normal tick over.If you are experiencing miss fires or backfires from cold, this would be a firm pointer to the electrical problems. You might want to check you have the right grade plugs in, from there give the H/T coils and leads a good spraying of ignition sealant. Hope this helpsBest of luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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