Hairsy

Oh this bike is driving me nuts! New fuel pump arrived and was fitted. Bike started immediately with a smooth tickover and would rev happily. I took the opportunity to check the charging voltage as I understand that these sometimes have reg/rec issues - 14.8v. Feeling happy. Plan was to just let the bike make its way up to temperature so I can check for any fluid leaks. After about 3-4 minutes at idle I tried revving a bit - revs briefly increased a little but then bogged down. Releasing the throttle would get it back to tickover. After a couple of attempts at this, the bike stalled and then wouldn't start. Tried choke on and off and it didn't make any difference. Tried with a little throttle and also didn't make any difference. Felt really fed up. Put the bike away to teach it a lesson. Not in the mood to do any more today. I'd welcome any suggestion but my thoughts are as follows: 1) Re-try the same exercise but open the tank cap just in case there's a vent issue. I really doubt it's this as so little fuel would have been used in a few minutes of idle but got to be worth a try. 2) Check each of the spark plugs in case they tell any stories 3) Strip the carbs down and give them a thorough clean - I didn't previously do this, hoping (optimistically) that I could leave well alone as they'd come off a running bike Incidentally, the rev counter did burst into life after a few seconds of running. At a later stage I'll be going through every electrical connector and clean them with contact cleaner - hoping that's my issue. I'm really looking forward to having a good day on this project.

Thanks - that's encouraging. Small update for today. I filled with coolant ready to do a run up to temperature to check for any leaks of oil / coolant / fuel. Started on the button but, annoyingly, died after about 5 minutes. Upon investigation, it seems that my repair of the fuel pump was short lived. New one arrives later this week so the run up to temperature is on hold. Did notice that the rev counter wasn't working. Will need to investigate that. So a classic one step forward, two steps back day!

After saying that the original pump contacts were too shot to be worth trying ... I decided to try anyway. The alternative was to sit around waiting for a few days for the new pump to arrive. While there are other jobs that I could be doing, I know that my motivation for those will come when the bike is running. That's the point at which I'll know that there's life in there and therefore all the other work becomes worthwhile. So I took the contact switch mechanism off the pump, broke it down to its parts, cleaned it and hit the contacts with some emery paper. After only a few minutes of work, I was left with two nice flat contact surfaces - certainly enough to be worth trying. So I put the mechanism back together. This took considerably longer than a few minutes. I really needed at least three hands, all of which needed fingers a lot smaller than mine. However, I got there eventually and connected the pump to a 12v battery - and there was life. I refitted the pump to the bike and checked that it was functioning in situ. Sure enough, as soon as the bike started cranking I could feel the pump in action. So I fitted the fuel tank again. This exercise is teaching me that a small auxiliary fuel tank with a bit of hose would be a really nice tool to have. But I don't have one right now so it was back on with the proper tank. I then left the bike overnight. I wanted a night's sleep where I could dream that when I turned the key everything would be good. But I knew that every step so far has involved solving one problem only to lead to discovering the next. But this afternoon I decided that the time had come. I hit the starter for 10 seconds or so. No life from the engine yet but, most importantly, no fuel leak from the pump (which, you may remember, was the original problem I'd found with the pump). I think that it had probably just not been connected properly - the previous owner having made some efforts of their own to get it running. So, with new confidence, I hit the starter again and ... she sprang into life. A really nice purr. The feeling of elation was huge. And fairly short lived. I glanced down and saw a steady flow of fuel coming out of the bottom of one of the carbs. At first glance, it appeared to be coming from the fuel drain so I assumed that must have been left loose (although I thought I'd checked). Sadly, it wasn't this. So I started her up again to see if I could find the source and realised there was too much leaking to be just the drain hole. I couldn't see the source of the problem but the rough location and quantity suggested to me that it could be from the hose that delivers fuel to carbs 1 and 2. I tried to reseat the relevant hose while the carbs were still in place but it didn't make a difference. I did get a bit of video of the leak but, being new to this game, I've now realised that I can't upload it. Just imagine a load of fuel leaking out of the bottom of a carb - that's what it looked like! So I whipped the carbs off again (I'm getting pretty quick at that), removed the suspect bit of a hose and examined it. It was in good condition with no splits. In a moment of complete faith, I decided to just put it all back together, taking particular care to ensure the hose was fully pushed into place and well clamped. Carbs went back on, including the now familiar fight with the manifold rubbers. Connected everything up, put tank back in place and hit the starter. Fired up straight away, settling to the nice purr again. And, in a moment of true joy, NO LEAKS! So I end the day feeling so much happier with my little project. There's still so much to do but knowing that the bike is running makes the whole thing worthwhile. P.S. I'm conscious that this is a very long winded way of saying "got the engine running, found a fuel leak and fixed it". However, I'm hoping that it's useful for any other amateurs to share the highs and lows that come with taking on a project without any true technical background.

Thanks - yes, I was aware that it needs to see crank movement. I'll report back ...

Fascinating read - thank you. Out of interest, have you followed the valuer's advice and only put occasional miles on the bike? Or have you decided to enjoy it?

Thank you Tinkicker. That's really helpful. I had looked a little in Honda part numbering but my thinking hadn't gone as far as that, particularly in regard to the same part being used for later bikes. Another small update for today. Added some fuel, turned on the petcock and no immediate leaks. Good news. So I prepared myself for that incredible feeling of elation as I achieved the first start of the bike since owning ... and nothing. Then remembered the choke. Sadly still nothing. Paused and had a quick check and there was some fuel leaking from the fuel pump. Quite demotivating to find a new problem. I couldn't see quite where the leak was coming from so removed the fuel pump. I was hoping to find a dodgy fuel connection or perhaps cracked fuel pipe but that all looked fine. The main body of the pump is sealed so it doesn't appear possible to strip it down. It's possible I could break into it but the chances of it sealing back up afterwards seem low. Before proceeding further with solving the leak though, I thought I'd check that the thing works. Bridged the fuel pump relay, turned on the ignition and nothing. Checked the supply to the relay and the pump itself and that's all good. Connected the pump to a 12v battery - and nothing. It's dead. There's a switch mechanism on top of the pump, underneath a plastic cap. I had a look at that and the electrical contacts (like on an old set of points) on the switch are shot to pieces. A quick look online and this is a common problem. It's just possible that I could file down and clean the contacts enough but there wouldn't be much left of them. Checked online and the switch mechanism is available from the US but a new pump can be had for £11 which is much cheaper than the switch alone. So that's now ordered and hopefully by the end of the week I'll be able to have another go at starting. I've put the petcock problem on hold. Provided I keep the fuel level low enough to only supply fuel set to reserve, I can effectively turn off the petcock by setting it to the normal 'run' position. And, finally, to make myself feel better about the whole thing I went out for a ride on my working bike in the glorious sunshine. Lots of bikes out and definitely helped the mood.

Small update following an hour's covid boredom relief in my garage ... I managed to fit the carbs to the old rubbers. Which was pleasing. I have some Autoglym trim and bumper gel and I remembered that it leaves rubber parts very clean, shiny and slippery. I applied a little to the boots and then cleaned up the faces of the carbs - and with a little persuasion the carbs seated correctly. I then had 10 minutes of panic as I realised that I'd forgotten to connect the choke cable and wasn't sure whether it could be connected with the carbs in situ. Turns out it can so I didn't need to remove them again. Next was to quickly make sure the petcock was working fine. Only it wasn't that quick. It turns out that when the petcock is in the middle 'off' position, it allows fuel to drop out at around a drop per second. The petcock seems to be riveted together and I can't see any easy way to get inside it. I'd really appreciate any thoughts on how critical a gently dripping petcock would actually be. If the float needles are working as required, is this actually going to leave me with a problem? For now, I've re-drained the fuel from the tank and then fitted the tank in place. So when I'm next working on it (maybe tomorrow), I'll put some fuel back in, check for any immediate fuel leaks around the carbs and then have my first attempt at starting. I was tempted to do it today but don't really have the energy to deal with any urgent problems like major leaks that might arise. The uncertainty of a bike that I know almost nothing about!

Oh wow - my very first bike was a DT50 of the same vintage. I'll start reading now ...

Following some gentle encouragement from someone, I thought I’d start a modest restoration thread. Apologies for the long first post. Before I start, let me explain that I am not an experienced restorer. This is a hobby for me and the project was simply inspired by having some success with my improving my current bike after I bought it. I’m going to make mistakes - maybe others can benefit from that. Or get some amusement. Please though - be nice! My goals for the restoration are: 1) To bring something mechanical back to life - I hate seeing things not working. 2) To learn, develop some skills and maybe in the future do another one. Or maybe realise that this sort of project is something that isn’t for me. 3) To not lose money. This may be a fairly optimistic goal but it means that this is VERY MUCH a budget restoration. I don’t want to bodge anything but this is going to be the kind of restoration that leaves a good bike but not a perfect one. I foresee comments on this thread telling me that I shouldn’t cut corners but I just don’t have the funds for perfection. My background is that I stopped riding bikes in 1987 when I switched to cars (there's your clue to my age) but decided to come back to two wheels last year. I bought a CBR600F4i that was in OK condition but hadn't been as loved as I wanted. I gave it the TLC that I felt it deserved. It's now looking great and is bang up to date on every service job in the book. I found the process really satisfying and decided that I should get myself a project bike for the winter. So, before Christmas I picked up a 1998 CBR600 F3. It was a non runner and the chap I bought it from seemed a thoroughly decent chap. It was 'as described' on eBay but I've learned some lessons from the experience and the job is a little larger than I'd expected. In hindsight, I should have gone to have a look at the bike before bidding on eBay but, as I say, there was nothing incorrect in the eBay description so here I am. The obvious first job is to get it running. Compression seems good and there's a healthy spark. It hadn't run for some years and, unsurprisingly, the carbs were in a dreadful state. So dreadful that my initial efforts at strip down led to broken jets and my efforts with extractors couldn’t strip the first carb I attempted. I decided to replace them with a set from a recently known running bike. I’ve now received those replacement carbs and they are MUCH better. I've given them a quick check over and cleaned the sliders and choke mechanisms that were slightly sticky. I plan to see how the bike runs before deciding whether they need a full service. The reason for this is that a quality rebuild kit is going to cost more than the carbs themselves. There are cheap kits on eBay but I don’t trust them with the sort of tolerances that are needed for carbs. If anyone has positive experiences with cheap kits though, please tell me! I’ll do the full carb rebuild if I have to but I was assured by the seller that these replacement carbs were on a well running bike 2 months ago - and they certainly seem reasonable. Yesterday I attempted to reinstall the carbs but the rubber boots are really hard and I can’t get the carbs back into them. The job wasn’t helped by the fact that I’ve current got Covid and am really tired - but I hate being in bed so had to do something! However, I didn’t persevere with the job for long because impatience isn’t going to help me do a decent job. I’m left with a few options for these rubbers. The first thing I’ll try is cleaning up the carb and boot surfaces and applying a little grease and see if I can get them in. If that doesn't work then I would have hoped to buy a new set of boots but, although they’re available for the F3 for only £10, the boots changed for the 1997/1998 model and I can’t find the correct ones. Originals from Honda will cost £60. So, if I’m not successful with the grease, then I think I’m going to have to try reconditioning the current boots with wintergreen oil. Once all that’s done, I’ll hopefully be able to see how the bike runs and determine whether the carbs need more work. Or whether there’s another problem causing the non-running. I’ve already drained the tank and it’s very clean inside - my main success so far! And then when the bike is running OK, I'll then need to sort out brakes, chain & sprockets, bearing checks, etc. They're all dirty and horrible but, from initial inspection I believe they're all in serviceable condition underneath the grime. Time will tell. And then finally, there is the frame (which some of you are already aware of). There's some surface corrosion on the frame. It really is only light cosmetic surface corrosion but it isn’t pretty. Very little of the frame is visible when the fairings are in place so I could leave it as-is - it's not a new bike after all. However I do think that, by the time I've prepared it, it will be really nice. There are some small repairs to the fairings and I had to replace the tail cowl but I think that once it’s all together, it’s going to look quite nice. Which means that I think the frame corrosion will spoil the look of the bike and so I want to do something about it. I can't justify a full stripdown and re-powdercoat of the frame. I'd do that if it was a keeper and held a place in my heart - but that's not really the case. So my choices are ... 1) Take off the surface rust and leave it at that, perhaps with a healthy dose of ACF50 or similar. This would improve the look but it doesn't feel quite enough to me - and rubbing down rust and doing nothing doesn't sit comfortably with me. 2) Do a very basic cosmetic improvement - perhaps some silver hammerite, maybe just to the areas that are visible when the fairings are on (which isn't much). This of course assumes that I can get something even close to a match with a hammerite-like product 3) My preference - take off all the visible surface rust, put a decent rust-converter / primer type product on there, and then rattle can spray with a decent matching colour I’ve had some suggestions on the paint match but nothing absolute. The paint codes on the bike are for bodywork not frame. A mainly US forum seems to think that the frame colour is NH-211M but I can’t seem to find anything definite and can’t find that paint available in the UK. Someone on here has suggested NH-460M which it seems I could get hold of. This seems to be a VFR800 colour and there’s a good chance that it's close enough - I’d be happy with a close match. As with all parts of this project though, I need to watch the spend and trialling paints could get expensive! And I’m left with one other niggling thing which is insurance. It’s not today’s problem but I’ll need to take the bike for MoT as some point and I’d really like to be able to take it out to test work I’ve done. I don’t want to ride without insurance. I will call my insurance company at some point to see if they have any suggestions but they’re a bog standard off-the-shelf insurer so I don’t really expect that they’ll have much experience of the type of cover I need. I can get single day insurance for around £35 which is my current option but it’s a bit expensive for a quick test ride from time to time. Anyway, as I said at the start, this isn’t your classic restoration but hopefully it will be of interest to some. And if anyone wishes to offer advice then please do. A few pictures below including the original carb that I attempted to strip down and gave up on and the corrosion that I want to address.

Thank you both - really helpful. I didn't really think of doing a thread. Maybe I should. I do enjoy them when others do them. It would be very much at the amateur end of the spectrum though ...

Thanks for taking the time to reply - and, hey, don't worry about it! I have over 2 decades of regular forum use on various subjects and I get it. Allow me to introduce myself and my project better ... I stopped riding bikes in 1987 when I switched to cars (there's your clue to my age) but decided to come back to two wheels last year. I bought a CBR600F4i that was in OK condition but hadn't been as loved as I wanted. I gave it the TLC that I felt it deserved. It's now looking great and is bang up to date on every service job in the book. I found the process really satisfying and decided that I should get myself a project bike for the winter. Moving on, before Christmas I picked up the CBR600F3 that I've been posting about. It was a non runner and the chap I bought it from seemed a thoroughly decent chap. It's fair to say it was 'as described' on eBay but I've learned some lessons from the experience and the job is a little larger than I'd expected. It's fair to say that I'm not going to make any money out of the process. My target is to enjoy bringing the bike back to life, see it go to a happy new owner and maybe (if I'm really lucky) break even. The obvious first job is to get it running. Compression is good and there's a healthy spark. It hadn't run for some time and, unsurprisingly, the carbs were in a dreadful state. So dreadful that, after some initial efforts at strip down, I decided to replace them with a set from a recently known running bike. I now have those replacement carbs and they are MUCH better. I've given them a quick check and light clean inside but will see how the bike runs before deciding whether they need a full service. The trouble I'm having with these is that the intake boots on the bike are super hard and I can't get the carbs back in the boots - that's my current challenge. New boots for the F3 are cheap but, annoyingly, Honda changed the boots for the last 2 years of the production and none of the cheap ones for sale fit my bike. Assuming the bike gets running, I'll then need to sort out brakes, chain & sprockets, bearing checks, etc. They're all dirty and horrible but, I believe, in decent condition underneath the grime. Time will tell. This leaves the big dilemma that you've been helping me with - what to do about that surface corrosion on the frame. It's not a new bike but I do think that, by the time I've prepared it, it will be really nice. The frame corrosion will spoil it. I simply can't justify a full stripdown and re-powdercoat of the frame. I'd do that if it was a keeper and held a place in my heart - but that's not really the case. So my choices are ... 1) Take off the surface rust and leave it at that, perhaps with a healthy dose of ACF50 or similar. This would improve the look but it doesn't feel quite enough to me - and rubbing down rust and doing nothing doesn't sit comfortably with me. 2) Do a very basic cosmetic improvement - perhaps some silver hammerite just to the areas that are visible when the fairings are on (which isn't much). This of course assumes that I can get something even close to a match with a hammerite-like product 3) My preference - take off the surface rust, put a decent rust-converter / primer type product on there, and then rattle can spray with a decent matching colour The tricky thing is that this is a hobby job and there isn't enough money to enable me to afford to try lots of different things to find a match. Anyway, thanks for your input so far. Please be assured, I will return when I finally conclude my work and let future readers know what I did and whether it had any positive effect.

I wasn't asking you to do the research. I was doing my own. I was simply asking whether you had experience of using the paint you recommended with the frame that you recommended it for. And you've answered that question. My apologies that I offended you. It wasn't my intention.

Hi Tinkicker, Can I just ask - have you used these paints and know they're a good match for the CBR600F3? Just checking before I commit to the job. I can't seem to find them branded as Holts but Simoniz have the same name products and appear to be linked to Holts. Many thanks.

Hi, I'm looking to make some cosmetic improvements to areas of surface corrosion on my CBR600F3. I'm not wanting to do a full strip down and powder coat - the bike doesn't warrant it (at least for me). I've attached some pictures blow of some of the areas - these are the main areas but I may treat a few others. I'd welcome suggestions for techniques and products to use for the frame and crankcase corrosion in the picture. At the moment I'm thinking to rub down the rust, treat it with one of the various 'straight to rust' primers that are available and then spray with a suitable paint that is a reasonable match. My questions are: 1) Would you agree with this approach? 2) What products have you successfully used? 3) Any suggestions on how to get a good colour match? A mostly American forum advised me to look for Honda paint code 'NH-211M' but a Google search has not been successful in finding a UK supply. Might it be a different code in the UK? Thank you for any advice - and Happy Christmas!