CBT Auto or Manual?

[ChrisBiggsUK]

Afternoon all.

I believe I mentioned in my first post here on the forums the other day (and shall now repeat in case people haven't read that post) that I'm brand new to this whole motorcycling thing and indeed driving as a whole.  My first ever provisional came through the post this morning!

I'm going to be doing my CBT in a couple of weeks time and am acquiring the basic kit (with some minor missteps).  While I'm doing all that, it has occurred to me that I need to ask some more advice, not kit related, but about the CBT itself.

Once I pass (if I pass) I will be buying myself a used motorcycle.  I don't want a scooter, nor a flashy sports type bike, just a relaxed 125cc cruiser type one (I've seen some good used 125's on autotrader and at the local dealer that would do me nicely) that is comfortable for my 43 year old (and not getting any younger) self to get to grips with, learn as I go on to get my full license, and will look slightly less silly than my 6'3", middle aged, slightly portly frame pootling round everywhere on a scooter.  Don't get me wrong, I'll still pootle round everywhere on a motorcycle, but I'll hopefully look less ridiculous than on a scooter.

Lengthy storytime over, on to the question bit;  At the test centre I'll be using, I have the option during the CBT of either doing it on an automatic scooter (50cc or 125cc) or a manual motorcycle (125cc).  It seems sensible to me to do the CBT on the type of bike that I'll be buying, that being manual, as I'll learn the basics about how to use said bike and that should then make my transition to my learner bike easier.  Makes sense to me.

At the same time, I'm also leaning towards not opting for the manual motorcycle to do the cbt but rather the automatic scooter as since this will be my first time riding, and indeed first time in charge of any motor vehicle, having fewer things on that end to focus on (clutch, changing gears etc) and instead more focusing on safely riding and taking in what I know will be a lot of information, seems sensible to me.

Both options seem sensible to me, but if I'm being brutally honest with myself, as much as I'd prefer to jump straight in with the manual motorcycle and get trained straight off the bat on that, I know that it will be a lot of information for me to take in in one go and a lot of nerves being a first time motorcyclist and so doing it on the scooter seems to be winning the argument in my head.

Actually, now that I've typed this all down, I realise that there isn't really any question anymore.  I'm going to do it on the scooter.  While I will be buying a manual to learn on once (if) I pass my CBT, it just makes much, much more sense to do the CBT on the scooter where I can focus more on the basics which, ultimately, is what the CBT is for.  I guess I just needed to type it all down to make it make sense in my head.

[Simon Davey]

A lot has changed (for the better) since my driving and bike tests 40 years ago. 

I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that it needs to be a manual during the test, to then be able to drive/ride a manual? 

[AstronautNinja]

Gotta vote for manual tbh. 

 

Doing a cbt on a scooter then buying a geared bike sounds like a difficult learning curve considering geared tuition is available. 

 

Bike clutches seem very forgiving 

[RideWithStyles]

Doing a cbt on manual or even auto sort of covers both sides of what you can do afterwards weirdly. do cbt - pass on auto and can be allowed to ride a manual with no intuition or owt afterwards which is what happened to the wife when she started out so it was up to me then to teach her how to ride a manual, bike and how to handle it .
she did well with extra tutoring (from me) with a few hiccups and drops, got there eventually but holy shite is an over sight and a short cut of the system personally I don’t agree on.

so while it can be done that way doesn’t necessarily mean it’s right or correct for every or anyone.

Riding an auto and manual do require slightly different ways especially with slow speeds.

Well one question pretty much answers the other.

if you want a cruiser (or near as the style goes) from 125 up to what ever capacity you want to end up at?
how many manuals are there? A lot.

How many autos are there for that type? VERY VERY FEW if none at all….

if you can drive a manual car then you have a rough idea on how it works, its just they’re more sensitive (shorter biting points, higher revs required etc), So a slight adaptation is required. Working balance and getting individual body parts to do fine movement (different ones too) at the same time.

 

same with road use and how you behave is roughly the same but a few tweaks needed.

Least you can learn from and while at the school to see where/if you need help rather than screwing it up and potentially getting yourself in the shite on the roads by your self trying to work out what you might be doing wrong while a hgv or other vehicle being not attentive bearing down into you, if its not working out and your DEFINITELY better off with a auto you know there and then without wasting a large chunk of your own money and time as you jumped a step and bought a bike before you should of. 
also goes to show how do you know the bike is right or working correctly if you haven’t even ridden one yet?

First rule dont trust nor take any dealers word for granted….

 

If you want/need to stick to autos, Big scooters 400-800cc are pretty big in size (loads of uses) for your human biometrics, pretty quick off the mark and will handle normal road uses very well, people see them as big old school bmw slush boxes.

the other option is to go down less adaptable and que less trodden paths (expensive and far fewer selection of normal as possible bikes) with automated transmissions.m, likes of Honda African twin, mv,

Edited September 18, 2024 by RideWithStyles
Auto correct

[ChrisBiggsUK]

1 hour ago, Simon Davey said:

A lot has changed (for the better) since my driving and bike tests 40 years ago. 

I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that it needs to be a manual during the test, to then be able to drive/ride a manual? 

 

From everything that I can find online, and indeed from local test centres when I was enquiring, doing the CBT on either manual or automatic means you can legally ride both (with L plates and either scooter or motorbike up to 125cc for me due to age).  Seems rather dodgy to me, but if thats what the law says, then thats what I'm going with.

 

[AstronautNinja]

21 minutes ago, ChrisBiggsUK said:

 

From everything that I can find online, and indeed from local test centres when I was enquiring, doing the CBT on either manual or automatic means you can legally ride both (with L plates and either scooter or motorbike up to 125cc for me due to age).  Seems rather dodgy to me, but if thats what the law says, then thats what I'm going with.

 

I'd suggest having a crack with gears, you'll quickly know if it's going to immediately work out or not. I'd imagine the school will have both available. It's probably worth a quick call to ask / explain. 

 

If you don't do a geared cbt then it's going to be a case of work it out sharpish in the dealers carpark surely? 

 

I'd rather learn under tuition than by the seat of my pants during a first ride

[Yorky]

Here's a quote from a reply to the same question posted in 2009.

 

"I have done my cbt on both a small auto and a large 125 manual.

And I found it easier to do it on a manual, mainly because they're easier to control at slow speeds because you can use both the clutch and back brake."

 

Seems to make sense to me.

[Shasel]

3 hours ago, Simon Davey said:

A lot has changed (for the better) since my driving and bike tests 40 years ago. 

I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that it needs to be a manual during the test, to then be able to drive/ride a manual? 

This is true for your test Mod 1 and Mod 2 but not for the CBT. For the CBT you can complete on an Auto and then legally ride a manual with L plates.

If the OP can pass on a manual then I would suggest that would be better but then I competed CBT on an auto and learned the manual aspect on my own time and it did me no harm.

[ChrisBiggsUK]

A little update to this.

So on advice here and from irl friends, I took a walk up to the centre this morning and had a chat with the chaps there.

They said that contrary to what their website says, they can let me start off the CBT on a scooter and if I feel comfortable, I can shift over onto the geared bike, get to grips with the gears and clutch and then, again if I'm comfortable and they are too, hit the road in the afternoon on the geared bike.  Seems like it is a win/win really.  They certainly put my mind at ease.

While I was there, I also took advantage of the fact that the centre I'll be testing at is also a bike dealership.  After learning from my helmet mistake, I asked to look at some jackets and with their guidance picked one up that fits wonderfully, is appropriately protective and was within budget.

Might have also bought a bike while I was there too.  And by might.  I mean I did.  Nothing flashy.  A 2006 Honda CG 125. 

Now I know, you will scream at me for buying a bike there and then but let me explain.  I had already done a lot of looking online, and had several bikes from different places bookmarked mattching my budget, close enough in looks to what I was wanting, and all from reputable dealers.  When I walked in to the dealership this morning to ask their advice, the sole bike I had bookmarked from them was right next to the counter.  I mean, literally right next to it.  As I was stood there chatting, the bike was at my hip.  Out of the myriad bikes they have there, this one was right there.  Right next to me.  It was almost as though it was meant to be.  I even mentioned as such as I was chatting to the chaps there.  And then when I was trying jackets on and asked if there was a chair I could sit on to see how the jacket felt sitting down, they popped me on the bike I had been eyeing up and everything just clicked into place.

My CBT will be booked next week, done about a week after that and then, provided I pass it (yes, I know it isn't pass or fail, I'm using pass to mean they are comfortable signing me off) I can literally ride off into the sunset on my own bike.

Everything is becoming very real very fast!

Edited September 19, 2024 by ChrisBiggsUK

[Fiddlesticks]

Very exciting

Congrats on the new bike - seems like a good choice.

[Simon Davey]

Good work @ChrisBiggsUK, great to hear you have such a helpful dealership nearby.

Great choice of bike, and absolute classic quality of a machine that won't let you down, has great balance and will have a good part exchange value when the time comes.

Good luck going forward.

[AstronautNinja]

38 minutes ago, ChrisBiggsUK said:

A little update to this.

So on advice here and from irl friends, I took a walk up to the centre this morning and had a chat with the chaps there.

They said that contrary to what their website says, they can let me start off the CBT on a scooter and if I feel comfortable, I can shift over onto the geared bike, get to grips with the gears and clutch and then, again if I'm comfortable and they are too, hit the road in the afternoon on the geared bike.  Seems like it is a win/win really.  They certainly put my mind at ease.

While I was there, I also took advantage of the fact that the centre I'll be testing at is also a bike dealership.  After learning from my helmet mistake, I asked to look at some jackets and with their guidance picked one up that fits wonderfully, is appropriately protective and was within budget.

Might have also bought a bike while I was there too.  And by might.  I mean I did.  Nothing flashy.  A 2009 Honda CG 125. 

Now I know, you will scream at me for buying a bike there and then but let me explain.  I had already done a lot of looking online, and had several bikes from different places bookmarked mattching my budget, close enough in looks to what I was wanting, and all from reputable dealers.  When I walked in to the dealership this morning to ask their advice, the sole bike I had bookmarked from them was right next to the counter.  I mean, literally right next to it.  As I was stood there chatting, the bike was at my hip.  Out of the myriad bikes they have there, this one was right there.  Right next to me.  It was almost as though it was meant to be.  I even mentioned as such as I was chatting to the chaps there.  And then when I was trying jackets on and asked if there was a chair I could sit on to see how the jacket felt sitting down, they popped me on the bike I had been eyeing up and everything just clicked into place.

My CBT will be booked next week, done about a week after that and then, provided I pass it (yes, I know it isn't pass or fail, I'm using pass to mean they are comfortable signing me off) I can literally ride off into the sunset on my own bike.

Everything is becoming very real very fast!

Impulsive bike purchases are the way forward

 

I also bought a bike before booking my cbt haha 

[RideWithStyles]

Nothing wrong with the choice of the Honda cg to be honest, good choice. Wife’s was a cbf125 2011 (newer with first time injection but based off the same bike ) with about 4k on the clock (£1700) and served very well over the many years we had it.
buy on condition, careful ownership with as full service history as possible if your buying but don’t know what your looking out for.

change oil every 700-1000miles unless it’s burning through which the engines do. These ones will have an internal oil strainer which requires the right side engine case to come off to get at. Good gaskets are a must and the bolts as not all the same size and length so don’t mix them up.

They hold very little oil so check the level every second fill up if used with intent/aggression, it will probably still be a dipstick so dont screw the dip in but place its first thread ontop of the case to check oil level and keep it at the upper level. Dont need owt fancy of expensive, just cheap semi synthetic ok will do.

The single front brake piston should be strong to a raise the rear up for a stoppie…certainly shamed toki that was on Kawasaki 600s with two calipers totalling 12pots of the era.

 

certainly better than Chinese trap that people fall into.

Edited September 20, 2024 by RideWithStyles

[Bender]

No one here is going to moan about you buying your first bike and it's a great pick.

[ChrisBiggsUK]

1 hour ago, Bender said:

No one here is going to moan about you buying your first bike and it's a great pick.

 

I think I was more concerned that being new to this whole biking thing, not knowing anything, and not even really looking at the bike itself too much other than doing some research online, I bought it, quite impulsively, when I was only there to ask for some advice.

Turns out that you are indeed quite correct that I shouldn't have been worried as I seem to have done the right thing.

I should note that although I impulsively purchased it, when I was doing research and looking at several bikes which were taking my fancy, I did do searches on their MOT histories etc and the one I bought has an almost spotless MOT history (one advisory for a worn tyre on its most recent MOT and one 'light misting of stanchion' advisory from 2015) and just a smidge over 5000 miles which, from what I can gather, on a bike from 2006, is rather good.

 

[Bender]

I bought a CBF when I started for 1k, I had it a year and sold it for 1k

[RideWithStyles]

As long as all the next mots didnt repeat or got worse then the garage and the owner’s were quite sympathetic to its requirements, good start. Then its condition will be next.

 

5 thou mileage? Its barely run in if looked after.

[ChrisBiggsUK]

7 hours ago, RideWithStyles said:

As long as all the next mots didnt repeat or got worse then the garage and the owner’s were quite sympathetic to its requirements, good start. Then its condition will be next.

 

5 thou mileage? Its barely run in if looked after.

 

It does seem as though it has been very well cared for, especially for an 06 plate 125.  

The two MOTs that flagged up minor advisories were the 2015 stanchion one (with no repeats so it must have been repaired) and the most recent being a worn rear tyre (which is no problem whatsoever and totally understandable).  I'll be getting it fully checked over myself when I take delivery either on the evening of my CBT or the following day, but from the MOT checks I have done, and the reputation of the dealership itself, I'm quietly confident I have got an absolute bargain of a beginner bike.  Indeed, when I was sat on it trying the jacket on, and before I bought it, it looked in almost pristine condition.  The only thing my admittedly untrained eye noticed was the tiniest of tiny dents on the top of the fuel tank.  And I do mean a really tiny one.  

I have attached some pictures of the bike I pulled from the dealers Facebook post.  I think (though I could be wrong) that for a 2006 bike that one would have expected to be put through the wringer in its lifetime, this one is practically unused.

[Old-codger]

It looks a nice bike look after it and you will get your money back when you sell it later on.

[RideWithStyles]

Cooor blimey looking solid and needs nowt great find! even with the greasy smear on the lens .

A afternoons worth of good clean (don’t use washing up liquid but a bike specifically one like muck off or car one IF you know it’s a non acidic and contains no salts or owt aggressive.

dry, detail and wax.

corrosion protection applied to bolts, brackets and other metal surfaces like the front frame etc - xpc clear coat is regarded the best also rubbed lightly on the spokes and rims.

silicone spray on the plastics and rubbers(not tyres).

Doing that is prevention and ease of use to keep clean next time.

Just needs a shine, it will look like it just came out of the factory again, keep on top of it and will still look great in another 18years.

 

owner has even left a top box mount ready for you!
Looks more like a givi but could be a shad, all you’d need to do is buy the box which most of the time depending on size of box the cheaper part of these kits.

Either way they are brilliant and incredibly useful with little if no real downsides-anybody saying otherwise are fashion hoes still stuck in the pre 2000’s.

Edited September 21, 2024 by RideWithStyles

[ChrisBiggsUK]

Went back to the dealership this morning and my bike is now paid in full, I have a nice little green slip (my first ever vehicle purchase!),Tax paid, insurance sorted (as a brand new driver my insurance, fully comp, including RAC breakdown assistance, legal expenses cover, personal injury cover and helmet and leathers cover, came in at just over £500 a year which I have been informed is very good all things considered) and CBT finalised for the 9th of October.
 

Everything is falling into place quite nicely and provided I pass my CBT (or rather, am certified as safe), on the evening of the 9th I shall be riding home on my brand new (used) bike!  My first ever bike or vehicle of any kind!

I'm excited.  Can you tell? 

Now to acquire Coffee and proper study the highway code and the 'know your traffic signs' books.