Casey Stoner change of heart.

[uk190]

Not Stoners, but mine.

i have never liked him, despite having him in my MCN fantasy team. however, having watched this weekends race at Phillip Island i have realised something.

for those who dont follow MotoGP, he has a corner named after him at phillip island, a corner that has become synonomous with his ability to slide the rear tyre. "nowt special" i always thought, lots of riders can slide the rear. until i realised his lowest recorded speed whilst doing it was 161MPH! this is short of un believable ability and was backed up by Ben Spies who has gone on record as syaing the he and other riders have not got a clue how Stoners manages it. Stoner has said it simple, he just clips the apex with his front tyre, turns the TC to its minimum and pins the throttle open to make it slide and point the bike in the right direction for the next corner.

how can i not like a rider who can do this at over 160?

http://weridemotorsports.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/stoner-sliding-front-perspective.jpg?w=500&h=333

what a loss to the sport he will be and its taken me years to realise it.

[techno]

He will be a loss, any particular reason you didn't like him?

[uk190]

He will be a loss, any particular reason you didn't like him?

 

according to him, nothing was ever his fault. and that the fact he was turning the races into a battle for second place, just like doohan did in the 90's. apart from that i cant actually think of a reason, i guess i just took a dislike to guy.

[ManInASuitcase]

I have no problem disliking the bloke.

Don't think he will lose any sleep though

[Matt Strange]

I don't "like" him much either, but when he puts his mind to the racing, he is the best out there in terms of natural ability. Some people come across as a little childish

sometimes in their attitudes towards sportsmen/women, rubbishing anyone they dislike. I used to be like that with regards to Ayrton Senna & Nigel Mansell, I was a

total Mansell Patriotic fanboi who refused to see that he had about 75% of Senna's raw talent on a good day. I was only about 10 though, so forgive me for that, I'm

34 now and admit to my F1 supporter failings just recently

If Stoner kept a little more metal focus, had a desire to continue in motogp, not to mention a chance of receiving the sort of VIP treatment & team deals some of the other riders have had,

he would surely have ended up more successful in this class than anyone?.

[Tankbag]

Fair dinkum UK190, Its gotta be that from an ankle biter he won heaps of dirt bike races being a ridgy-didge rider but he is a toothy ocker piker who just didn't get it was a shag on the rock that the pommy bastards just didn't quite like his whacka.

(references http://www.koalanet.com.au/australian-slang.html#L )

[Joeman]

Stoner has said it simple, he just clips the apex with his front tyre, turns the TC to its minimum and pins the throttle open to make it slide and point the bike in the right direction for the next corner.

 

How does he get the back tyre to break free at over 160??? on slicks??

[fullscreenaging]

Power. We just can't imagine the power of these MotoGP machines.

[uk190]

The lean angle and therefore reduced contact patch / reduced weight over the rear also contribute.

The fact that it slides isn't the shocker but the fact that he does it on purpose and controls it with the throttle is the bit that is almost incomprehensible.

[techno]

They all do it as you said, there won't be much between most of them.

[fullscreenaging]

The lean angle and therefore reduced contact patch / reduced weight over the rear also contribute.

The fact that it slides isn't the shocker but the fact that he does it on purpose and controls it with the throttle is the bit that is almost incomprehensible.

 

The time when the tyre has the least contact patch is when it's upright. The more the lean angle the bigger the contact patch http://sportbike.natkd.com/tires.htm

[uk190]

When upright the tyre is deformed by the weight of the bike and rider. As such the contact patch increases.

When leant over the amount weight being transferred through the tyre is less and so the tyre is not forced into the tarmac as much. Hence less grip and a propensity to break traction and slide easier.

[fullscreenaging]

You've got it the wrong way round. Read the website I linked to. About half way down there is a diagram and explanation.

[uk190]

Wasn't really gonna descend into a big debate on this thread about tyre grip and design and physical forces. Especially when some of it based on data pulled from the net lol. But I Did read it. It does not make any account for forces through the line of force through the axis. Shape deformation. Side wall flex. Rotational force. Tyre pressure. Temperature. Track adhesive. Or even tyre wear. Yes in simple terms the "multi profile" shape provides greater surface area towards the edge and if the tyre was carved from oak then it would remain a constant. As evident in their not very accurate diagram. The diagram is flawed and is a artists rrepresentation representation of the principle. It's badly drawn lol. If you look at it closely you'll see the shape differs in each angle of lean. Because tyre are not made of oak but more flexy stuff the Parabolic proffile shape alters under different loads.speed off rotation. Speed and associated centrapetal force. Bike suspension stiffness. Carcass flexibility and so on and so on. This could go on being debated but the fact remains that grip diminishes as the lean angle increases. Otherwise racers would not need to stand the bike to vertical so they can apply full power. Apologies for shirt grammar and punctuation but am typing from my phone and I have fingers like pigs tits and don't get on with touch screens and auto correct hates me lol.

[fullscreenaging]

Only one way you can go when the bike is upright and that is straight forward. It then and only then you can give it full power. Give it full power when leant over and we all know what happens.

We'll agree to disagree.

[Mrbarry]

I don't know when you have the biggest contact patch, i do know to cause the loss of traction you have to overcome the physical grip between tyre and road. The tyre can only take so much and the harder you lean the more force you apply that is trying to break the grip, so if you try to accelerate as you lean it's time to learn to fly.

If your lean angle is applying 80% of what the rubber can take you can use the throttle a bit to take up the other 20% before you slide. Bike upright u have 100% left to use the throttle before wheel spins/slips. So if you are leaning HARD using all the tyres grip then the throttle will easily make the rear end slip. It's simple enough.

[Tiggie]

I know its an old thread but after reading Martins first post I had to go on youtube to see the corner for myself

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR2265_udBY