Should observers be punished?

[Guest]

Ok, so this is just out of curiosity really.

Ok so you are stood around and someone commits a crime in front of you. Either stealing something, hurting someone, etc any sort of crime you like.

Instead of acting or doing anything to either prevent or report the crime you don't act. You just walk away and let it happen.

Should you be punished? Or should people be made an example of?

Is this wrong? Why can't we enforce morals onto people?

Any input, thoughts, feelings welcome nothing heated just keep it friendly and civil.

[Glorian]

No?

Otherwise where is the line drawn? is there an age limit? men as well as women? Disabled people? Also you then encourage have-a-go-heroes and cause people to get in more danger, as you never know what weapons or accomplices people might have.

Best thing a bystander can do is call police. and discretly record what they can and take in as much information. Anything else is up to each person what they choose to do, but to punish people is just stupid.

[RantMachine]

Dunno about walking away, as there's a self preservation factor... but anyone that films it then sticks it on Youtube should be publicly shamed/abused somehow. Maybe install a set of social media stocks in every town square and have a web camera with a 24/7 live feed, then let nature take its course.

[Guest]

No?

Otherwise where is the line drawn? is there an age limit? men as well as women? Disabled people? Also you then encourage have-a-go-heroes and cause people to get in more danger, as you never know what weapons or accomplices people might have.

Best thing a bystander can do is call police. and discretly record what they can and take in as much information. Anything else is up to each person what they choose to do, but to punish people is just stupid.

 

Ok what about just doing "what is within their capable means"

So if you could pick up the phone and call the police but don't for example. Should you be, I don't know, educated in some way? So next time you'll feel less inclined to just be another bystander who does nothing.

[Glorian]

What if they don't have a phone. Problem with punishing people for that is you have to put guidelines in place of what does and doesn't constitute enough action.

Also it just makes people less protected and criminals more imo.

[Guest]

Years ago people would do something!

But that world doesn't exist anymore!

[RantMachine]

DID SOMEONE SAY "STATE SPONSORED RE-EDUCATION"??

 

Years ago people would do something!

But that world doesn't exist anymore!

Hang on a minute, when did Kitty Genovese die...?

[Arwen]

Years ago people would do something!

But that world doesn't exist anymore!

 

Agreed.

But there are many reasons for people not taking action on others.

Some is down to self preservation. Another is in not wanting the law turned on them if they do take action against people committing a crime. Both are valid in my opinion.

If there was more protection for people to restrain or stop others from doing a criminal act, then people might be more envolved with crime stopping. However the law is more protective of the criminals these days...

[Guest]

DID SOMEONE SAY "STATE SPONSORED RE-EDUCATION"??

 

Years ago people would do something!

But that world doesn't exist anymore!

Hang on a minute, when did Kitty Genovese die...?

 

I'm talking about Swansea......not New York!

If something was going down people would get stuck in!

[RantMachine]

I think Arwen hit the nail on the head. All the scaremongering in the past decade or two about people being prosecuted for defending themselves or their own property have left people worried that they'll be done for assaulting the perpetrator if they get involved. Sad state of affairs! Best bet is to carry a ski mask everywhere so if you do get stuck in you can do so anonymously

Holy crap, maybe we really DO need a Batman

[Guest]

I think Arwen hit the nail on the head. All the scaremongering in the past decade or two about people being prosecuted for defending themselves or their own property have left people worried that they'll be done for assaulting the perpetrator if they get involved. Sad state of affairs! Best bet is to carry a ski mask everywhere so if you do get stuck in you can do so anonymously

Holy crap, maybe we really DO need a Batman

 

Haha, certainly sounds like it sometimes. How long before things get so bad and people still just stand by doing nothing?

It's a shame as the world is a great place, it's just some of the people who we share it with that ruin it.

[Guest]

My friend pointed something out to me..... in Starship Troopers they do something similar but instead of punishing the people who don't act they reward those who do.

Civilians and Citizens.

[Guest]

Really though......this is the reality of the situation: The imminent extinction of the Alpha Male!

I've seen it myself......even with my own sons. Young males becoming more androgynous.......and in touch with their feminine side! FFS!

If I'd had a feminine side (which I didn't) then I'd have f**ked it! And then dumped it. Usually miles from home!

I'm sure you'd be surprised to know that before I became a wise old uncle/doddering old git type, I was a bit of a bad boy in my younger days.

My somewhat thoughtless and ungentlemanly behaviour towards females was the stuff of folklore! I took more smacks in the face from females in the 70's than when Richard Dunn fought Muhammad Ali.

And I was by no means the only one like that! Ironically, despite the bad reputation as a liar, charmer, and womaniser, I was in great demand! The girls wanted a bad boy! And probably (if they were honest) they still do!

However.....the Steve McQueen's, Bon Scott's, Lee Marvin's, Ronnie van Zant's, and Frank Sinatra's of this world are a thing of the past.

More info here: http://www.intellectualtakeout.org/blog/why-we-need-alpha-males

I'm too old to be a Bad Boy now.......so this is the role I'm now doomed to play out ad infinitum!

[Guest]

I only care for and protect people I Love. People that aren't my Loved ones mean absolutely nothing to me

[Six30]

This is excellent bully karma ...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=516_1386217397

[cockercas]

To much hassle, im not anti police or anything but they are hard work to deal with.

Once reported a loose dangerous dog that i know bites and i got a telling off from firearms police

[Six30]

I only care for and protect people I Love. People that aren't my Loved ones mean absolutely nothing to me

 

What about a fellow ginger ?

[cockercas]

And it depends on the crime/how much i cared on that day if id intervene or not.

If i saw someone scratching a car down my street id do something about it but if it was 2 streets over where they double park on both paths so my girlfriend/kids have to walk to school on the road id just walk past

[Guest]

I only care for and protect people I Love. People that aren't my Loved ones mean absolutely nothing to me

 

What about a fellow ginger ?

 

Fellow ginger ermmm "Burn motherfecker burn"

[Joe85]

People talk about back in the old days with rose tinted glasses. it's worth remembering that in the world that did exist, there was a thing called the "Pedophile Information Exchange" and it was entirely legal.

Also, establishment child abuse was rife and went unchallenged for Decades.

[Guest]

People talk about back in the old days with rose tinted glasses. it's worth remembering that in the world that did exist, there was a thing called the "Pedophile Information Exchange" and it was entirely legal.

Also, establishment child abuse was rife and went unchallenged for Decades.

 

As someone who was around all those years ago, I can tell you for sure that nobody (and I'm talking people in the street) had any clue about that stuff.

All we knew was what the TV news and newspapers told us.....nothing else. So it wasn't "unchallenged".....it was "unknown". Saville? We knew nothing!

It's only years later that all this became public knowledge.....in fact if you asked people in the 70's what "pedophilia" meant nobody would have a clue. The word didn't exist in our vocabulary.

They were "child molesters" back then......and I can tell you now they didn't last long in communities before people did something about it. And the cops invariably turned a blind eye!

[Joe85]

People talk about back in the old days with rose tinted glasses. it's worth remembering that in the world that did exist, there was a thing called the "Pedophile Information Exchange" and it was entirely legal.

Also, establishment child abuse was rife and went unchallenged for Decades.

 

As someone who was around all those years ago, I can tell you for sure that nobody (and I'm talking people in the street) had any clue about that stuff.

All we knew was what the TV news and newspapers told us.....nothing else. So it wasn't "unchallenged".....it was "unknown". Saville? We knew nothing!

It's only years later that all this became public knowledge.....in fact if you asked people in the 70's what "pedophilia" meant nobody would have a clue. The word didn't exist in our vocabulary.

They were "child molesters" back then......and I can tell you now they didn't last long in communities before people did something about it. And the cops invariably turned a blind eye!

 

Yeh i should be clearer. I don't for a second think the average guy was ok with rabid nonce cases everywhere, the establishment certainly were though. Passing kids around like currency.

It raises the point made by the OP though. Some people were aware, some very powerful and high profile people, and they did nothing.

Should they be prosecuted? Hell yes.

[Guest]

People talk about back in the old days with rose tinted glasses. it's worth remembering that in the world that did exist, there was a thing called the "Pedophile Information Exchange" and it was entirely legal.

Also, establishment child abuse was rife and went unchallenged for Decades.

 

As someone who was around all those years ago, I can tell you for sure that nobody (and I'm talking people in the street) had any clue about that stuff.

All we knew was what the TV news and newspapers told us.....nothing else. So it wasn't "unchallenged".....it was "unknown". Saville? We knew nothing!

It's only years later that all this became public knowledge.....in fact if you asked people in the 70's what "pedophilia" meant nobody would have a clue. The word didn't exist in our vocabulary.

They were "child molesters" back then......and I can tell you now they didn't last long in communities before people did something about it. And the cops invariably turned a blind eye!

 

Yeh i should be clearer. I don't for a second think the average guy was ok with rabid nonce cases everywhere, the establishment certainly were though. Passing kids around like currency.

It raises the point made by the OP though. Some people were aware, some very powerful and high profile people, and they did nothing.

Should they be prosecuted? Hell yes.

 

Absolutely! But looking back it's scary how naive and ill-informed we were. We were just spoon fed total shit!

We were brought up to believe the Russians wanted to nuke us, that only other governments did bad things and we were the good guys, that our Monarchy were a shining example to the world, that countries who spoke in other languages were somehow inferior to us, that we civilized the world etc etc.

We had no way of knowing any different back then......so it was the ruling elite just controlling the proles. We were only told what we needed to be told just to keep the cogs moving.

Now of course the cat's out of the bag! Despite that......the Elite are still untouchable, so in reality we haven't made much progress!

[Joeman]

So every time we get in the car we have to dial the police and give them a running commentary on all the law breakers we share the roads with??

[Throttled]

Punish observers as in witnesses, no. I can well understand why people will see crimes and walk away and not want to give evidence.

I would punish enablers, as in those who repeatedly witness the same crime or a serious crime and do nothing about it. That already happens with certain terrorist legislation. If you know someone is engaging in criminal acts and you do nothing about it, then you are an enabler. Many people were enablers when it came to the Jimmy Saville abuse case. There are BBC and other executives who should be facing charges.

However, there are instances when people would love to report criminal activity but fear for their jobs or even lives. So at the same time I would enhance so called "whistleblower" and witness protection.