New member + no spark

[leener]

Yes, I'm new here and not posted on any forum in years. Used to use gbbikers about a decade ago, and visor down, but after been off bikes for years, I'm back.

It'll be nice to meet some of you guys, and hopefully you do meet up have a few rides out. I'm looking forward to it.

So, before I can jump in and be a real biker again (as opposed to pretending I am on one and making the noises), I have a zzr600d that is old as boots and needs work. I have given it a quick paint, got an engine in, did oil and filter, new plugs, replaced coils, leads, rear wheel and various bits, and it ran. I even cleaned out the disgusting carbs. It ran great, except the slight issue of randomly cutting out in the odd occasion after I took it up and down the road. It's definitely electrical (the problem) and the side stand switch isn't the issue. I took it for a quick run this morning and it died around the block so ended up pushed up a steep hill.

The tank is off and the Volt meter is on it. The thing is getting fuel, the fuses are OK, the solenoid is reading around 12v and sod all when you to start, the leads were a tad crap, so replaced a couple to get around 5 ohms each, the coils are getting plenty of power but not thoroughly tested then yet (too much pain), and there's definitely no spark (I did the test with the plug in the lead against the frame and engine).

When I feel up to it I am going to try and get some response from the coils, but running out of patience with this thing.

Anyone want to add their two pence?

I'm up in Mangotsfield, Bristol if anyone is around fancy popping round for a cuppa in the week.

[ThePhatomfart]

Hello leener and welcome to the forum

[raesewell]

Hello leener I too used to be on GBBikers with Sue and Andy and attended a few events.

Welcome aboard.

[Stu]

Hi leener welcome to the forum you may know a few members on here!

When you say you have no spark is it the spark that goes and stops it running or do you lose all power to the bike?

[Tango]

Welcome to TMBF mate. .........

I assume that the CDI unit is ok?.......and the crank sensors check out?........did you check more than 1 plug for sparking?

[Mr Fro]

Hello!

Something doesn't like being jiggled...

The troubleshooting has already begun.

I recently found out that any issues with the neutral switch, side stand switch or associated wiring = no spark.

[leener]

So glad there's some familiar faces in here. I mostly remember swylo and his brother, Kev. I was in the gbbikers group as "silent-kev" and missed the old days, going for rides out like on the Christmas and Easter run. I was gutted to hear about what happened to the site.

Hopefully i will be back on 2 wheels again and come out and play again. Nice warm welcome

Back to the bike situation... It ran, I did ride it a bit to test it (insured but needs MOT) - I know it was naughty...

Around the block (dead quiet road until I started the bike), it ran a little jerky at first but after the crud cleared from the bottom of the tank it was fine.

But, as I pulled up to the drive it cut out the engine. I could start it again, and it went for a but more and did it again. Eventually, it didn't do it anymore and it wasn't a problem.

I ran it up the revs, but when sat stationary in neutral you rev it hard and it goes a little below idle and back up again - so maybe need to give the carbs another quick shot through each jet.

Today, I ran it around the block just before the MOT and it died less than 200 ft from the door. This time it refuses to start.

I took the spark plugs out and tested each one on the lead to visually inspect, but no spark.

The leads are giving a resistance reading but not tested the coils. I have another pair I can try later when I'm up to it but feeling a bit crappy today.

There is lots of power coming into the coils from the loom and no fuses are blown, but that's as far as I got. Also checked the tank, fuel line and vacuum, which are an OK. And tried a bit of easy - start first before all this, but it's dead.

Battery is new, all electrics work (except the fuel float).

CDI seems to be OK on the multimeter but can't test much more than that.

Just can't face stripping it down again

[TimR]

Check the back of ignition switch .

The solder joints have a tendency to become weak and lose connection ( outside lane of m4 at speed)

[ThePhatomfart]

Love these bikes, had the same one for a commuter 40miles every day ,winter and summer never let me down, coils and connectors can be a little iffy sometimes, have got the digital manual if you need it

[leener]

Cheers guys. I had a quick look at it this morning. The coils are not really giving any reading (both pairs) but I get 0.01v from end of each lead to the red wire connecting the coil. The plugs look a bit crappy but they are new, so need to do checks inside the engine soon. Luckily I have another one rebuilt out back (by previous owner). He left the details of the new shims he put in, the valve clearances, and such in the Haynes manual. I may have to put it in at some point....

Ignition wires are all fine. It tries to turn over but no spark, so I'll try another new plug and then give up for now.

Really I'm contemplating flogging it off and getting one that just runs. I am desperate to get out there.

And a digital manual would be great, thanks

[ThePhatomfart]

Hi check your PM's for manuals

[ThePhatomfart]

A good earth on these bikes is a must I found in the past

[leener]

Can't thank you enough for the digital manuals.

Well, I have had some fun with this bike...

Trying to do the while feeling like death is not that easy, but I enjoy it, so I will persevere.

Ignition switch is fine

Ignition coils seem fine

Ht leads are ok

Spark plugs not great but should still spark (5ohms)

Pickup coil is fine

Rectifier is fine

Solenoid is fine

Which leaves me with one suspect... Mr CDI. I have no idea how anyone would test one without another bike, so I did a few checks, and the power pins show continuity... The rest of the pins are null, and one fluctuates badly and goes down to null. I am pretty much stuck here. I am getting another plug to make 100% sure that they aren't the issue, and then consider another CDI box, or open the tub and get my soldering iron out.

I'm no mechanic, but I think I'm on the right tracks.

[ThePhatomfart]

Looks like your on the right course, there's something Sherlock Holmes said about eliminating the impossible and whatever left is the possible, or something like that

[Mr Fro]

What's the part number on your CDI?

I've just upgraded the unit on my '95 ZXR750 so have the original going spare...

[leener]

Morning

Just been looking up the wiring diagram for the CDI / igniter. The part number is 21119-1285. It's just a series of diodes and coils/relays inside.

The coils are knackered and it's definitely a dud.

I have tested it thoroughly and learnt a lot about how they work.

If you have a spare then that's going to be a massive help.

[Mr Fro]

Sounds like you've pinned it down then!

Mine is 21119-1363 and apparently in not compatible. There are quite a few on eBay around the £40 mark.

[johnnyrod]

Hello, I'm new on here too although I used to be on a similar forum when I lived on the Wirral (now in Carlisle)

[leener]

Welcome, johnnyrod

And, shame about the CDI unit - I could swear that one of the 700+cc Kwaks used the same one. Oh, well. I got another one off feaBay and carefully observed the description to make sure it says "in working condition", so if it doesn't work.... I know I can get my cash back

Thanks, anyways

Hopefully it'll be here by Tuesday. I am desperate to get that bike fired up.

Knackered CDI would explain the random behaviour when I was running it.

Next step, take the turbo out of the 1.9 cdti Vectra that I'm stripping for parts and form a plan to hook it up to the zzr

[ThePhatomfart]

Welcome, johnnyrod

And, shame about the CDI unit - I could swear that one of the 700+cc Kwaks used the same one. Oh, well. I got another one off feaBay and carefully observed the description to make sure it says "in working condition", so if it doesn't work.... I know I can get my cash back

Thanks, anyways

Hopefully it'll be here by Tuesday. I am desperate to get that bike fired up.

Knackered CDI would explain the random behaviour when I was running it.

Next step, take the turbo out of the 1.9 cdti Vectra that I'm stripping for parts and form a plan to hook it up to the zzr

That could be interesting, keep the pictures coming

[Mr Fro]

Sorry about that - they look exactly the same. Some 'Murcin forum people reckon they're not compatible but I don't know why.

If your eBay special fails to work you can always try mine.*

You can join the TMBF Turbo club. Total members so far: 0.5.

*I take zero responsibility if flames or breaking occur!

[leener]

awesome!

No idea why they aren't compatible, but we'll see on Tuesday or Wednesday if it works. I tested as much as I can for now, so hoping this is the fix. Here's a pic of the 27 year old CDI box I currently have... With lots of dead resistors and diodes. Not much working in there anymore.

I have this Vectra sitting out back that is slowly turning into a shell as I sell parts off, so the turbo gave me the idea. I honestly need to do lots of research first.

[Mr Fro]

I've started a thread about my conversion. Which I'm updating as I go - currently waiting for bits though. I'm using a Garrett GT2052 from a diesel Volvo.

See if you can download Maximum Boost by Corky Bell, it's loaded with info. If you can't find it I can email you the pdf.

[leener]

Just downloading it now. It's big... I think, 3 minutes to download.

A good bedtime read, I think.

I watched one video of a blade 900rr on turbo and I was hooked, since I used to own one. They are crazy enough without a turbo, but with enough funding I am determined to do it.

Only problem is I have a zzr600d now, but can be equally as fun if set up properly.

Any pics or vids of your setup?

[leener]

This is a puzzle now. I have replaced the ignitor box (or CDI) from a working bike, checked each lead and plug to see a spark... Ran it up the road and it died again. It started after so I could ride it back down the hill, and now it's back on the drive.

It feels a little grumbly when keeping a steady speed, and just feels "off", like before the last CDI popped.

I genuinely am at a loss now.

It will start but will cut out completely at any random point when being ridden.

If you sit still and rev it, no sudden death. It revs fine...

It has a battery that is bigger than the tray, so not the same one.

It has a new fuel hose that is a little long, but not squashed or restricted. New plugs.