fastbob Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 OK , I dont think putting a feeler gauge down the side of the pistons is the way to go . What you do is pull the barrels right off to expose all the pistons . I'm not sure what you're thinking about when you mention dropping the crank , you leave the bottom end well alone for this job. When you pull the barrels off you ease them up slowly and insert clean rags in the gaps incase there are any bits of broken piston ring ready to fall into the depths of the engine . If the rings are intact you measure for wear by taking a piston ring and Inserting it in the barrel and then measuring the gap . Depending upon what you find you can often get away with a mild honeing of the bores plus new rings . If the bores are very worn or deeply scored then its a rebore and pistons . All of this stuff is expensive and quite hairy stuff if you have never done it before so watching a few good YouTube videos is a good plan . I feel a little guilty about mentioning all this stuff because I am aware that your original plan was to fix a bike that was just a bit of a smoker in order to sell it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Vertical scores in barrel 2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastbob Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Vertical scores in barrel 2? That's a picture of the bucket location not a cylinder bore isn't it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastbob Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Are we confusing our buckets with our barrels ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 The bores in 2 and 3 could be inspected, as I left it at TDC. The cylinder walls were mildly scored So I assumed [mention]leener[/mention] was talking about barrels liners The scoring on the valve lining could be manufacturing marks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastbob Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 The bores in 2 and 3 could be inspected, as I left it at TDC. The cylinder walls were mildly scored So I assumed @leener was talking about barrels liners The scoring on the valve lining could be manufacturing marks? I think so. No need for a perfect finish on something designed only to be seen once or twice ( or never ) in the life of the bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Unless [mention]megawatt[/mention] chimes in then its probably manufacturing marks and nothing to worry aboutSo back to the cylinders having scores..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 17, 2018 Author Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) I think I’ll clean up the piston surfaces as best I can, but not keen on getting too deep into fixing it, unless I decide to buy another car and keep the bike... baby on the way, so wanted to sell the bike to afford a reasonable, cheap car, without cracking into the bank. My crappy car is due mot by 26th May, and would sooner see world peace than pass. The bores of the cylinders were scored slightly. Nothing too mad.I was pointing out that I noticed massive scoring on the wall of where one that of shim buckets sits. Just looked awful. The pic in the above post was the best pic of it.Dog was upset because I didn’t throw the ball. I’m in his garden, so I am obligated. I’ll try to snap some new pics of the cylinder bores tomorrow to show the condition... hopefully, you’ll say, “perfect! No work needed”. But I enjoy this kind of work. Edited February 17, 2018 by leener Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 The piston tops dont look bad TBHI wouldn't worry too much about getting them shiny......just a little scrub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megawatt Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Need to get a closer look at bucket bores, as long as scores not too deep they're OK. Liners probably just need cross hatching. If big ends are splittable, I'd have a look at pistons and ring end gaps. If not I'd risk it for a sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 The carbon seems to be easy enough to remove from the surface, but noted the carbon burnt to the walls top. I can't see anything to tell me more about any problems, such as the piston ring.The only thing I noted was the carbon on the top of the walls, and slight scoring... I have cleaned them up as much as I have the energy to do, and will do more by the time I fit the new head gasket, and put it back together. Between us, with no prior experience, we have rebuilt the top end, which was rather fun!I managed to rip the end can off an old kawasaki micron exhaust system, that used to sound loud. I can get that to fit... Maybe later.Proud of the work we've done so far. The next part is reassembly, unless I need to do more?The rest is ready to go back on. Right now, need to do housework. Lots of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 The carbon is there because the rings dont go all the way to the topQuick cleanCylinder crosshatch looks okHead nice and cleanThe minor vertical marks are not too deep.....if to keep I would sort it but for resale I say bolt it all back togetherYour going faster than my rebuild....I forgot to take putty measurements so thats on the cards for Wednesday as i dont want to be riding with a potential bomb between my legs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 It might be a little while before I sell it, because I am just craving to get back on.Yeah, I'll bolt it all back up next weekend, pending the weather. The cylinder bores seem OK, the pistons aren't showing any obvious issues, and I am only praying (to the big electron in the sky) that the valve stem seals are the culprit of the blue smoke starting.I will carry out a clearance check once more, just as I get the cams back on. New exhaust gaskets still need going in, and new exhaust studs are here.The head gasket will get extra special care, when going in. To me, it looked like the last one wasn't really fairing too well.The bodywork of the bike isn't great. Upon taking it apart, I have noticed a lot of paint bubbling and flaking. The rear footpeg brackets are the worst, with rusty bolts, and same for the swing arm. I may need to get that deal with.Has anyone had experience with getting the bodywork redone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastbob Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 Just a thing that has occurred to me . I am sure you're aware that when you tighten down the camshaft caps its measured in inch pounds so if you don't already have one you will need a little torque wrench . It's amazing how little force is required on these bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 20, 2018 Author Share Posted February 20, 2018 Just a thing that has occurred to me . I am sure you're aware that when you tighten down the camshaft caps its measured in inch pounds so if you don't already have one you will need a little torque wrench . It's amazing how little force is required on these bolts. I need to get a bit of reading done on the process for re-bolting it all together... I have one big torque wrench for over 120nm, and one little one that goes up to around 20nm, in preparation. I'm looking forward to this... And the tense moment when I go to start it.I'll take my time and check things over several times, step by step. The manual comes in handy, but I have a Haynes somewhere that I need to dig out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I'm looking forward to this... And the tense moment when I go to start it. It's a great feeling when you've had an engine in pieces and it starts after going back together! Hope it all goes smoothly, top job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 It's a great feeling when you've had an engine in pieces and it starts after going back together! Hope it all goes smoothly, top job Cheers! I certainly hope it goes well. Tomorrow is the big day. Just doing some homework before the fun begins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megawatt Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Did you check the seal on the valves with petrol or paraffin or brake cleaner? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 Did you check the seal on the valves with petrol or paraffin or brake cleaner? I did, and nothing leaks through at all.Perfect seal.What confused me, was the Haynes book. The torque stages were 20nm, then 27, then 90 degrees angle. I did each step, but seemed a lot less tight than when they were coming off. I noticed that the impact grade t50 torx but that I used had actually bent, from removing them. They are all in, exactly to what the manual specification states.Cam chain went up, cams lined up, chain on, ladder on, rocks cover on, with all seals in perfectly. I even cranked it by hand to ensure that the timing is correct. Then, I realised that I forgot the two bolts on the side of the head. I tried to fit them... And had some problems... One problem is that they were over 14nm going in the last CM, so very difficult, because also trying to turn the torx bit with a fat wrench is impossible. There simply isn't enough clearance. Getting then out was hard enough. Need new bolts, and a better tool. Just stopped for a sandwich, now. I'm exhausted. I've been at this thing since 9am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megawatt Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Worth running a tap into the threads as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megawatt Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Worth running a tap into the threads as well. Bolts shouldn't be tight going in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 The worst problem right now is 50 odd psi on each cylinder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastbob Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 They don't necessarily have to be torx bolts . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leener Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 I'll sort the bolts later, after I have cracked it open again tomorrow, to check the torque of the head cylinder bolts.I clearly haven't tightened them nearly enough, because the highest psi compression test was only 60. I have packed away for now, because there's only so much you can do in a day. Totally exhausted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowBusa Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 How are you checking TDC?Im thinking valve timing too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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