CBR600 F3 1998 - amateur restoration

[Hairsy]

Probably just brief updates for the next couple of days as it's mostly just spannering.

 

Fitted the rear brake master cylinder & pedal.

 

 

Fitted the rear wheel and got the chain set up well and lubricated.

 

 

Fitted the rear caliper, new pads and replaced the brake fluid. All looking so much better than before. The rubber is missing on one of the hose clamps but I made one out of a bit of black rubber I had in the loft. Just took the picture too soon.

 

 

 

[Hairsy]

More rebuild work today.

 

First the gear shift mechanism. Like many parts, although not perfect, this was really corroded and horrible when I got the bike and now looks much better.

 

 

Then on to the cockpit area. First was a fair bit of loom cleaning and then torquing up all the bolts round the triple clamp and clip-ons. And finally cleaning the whole area and refitting the newly painted bar ends.

 

 

Next job was fitting the passenger footpegs and remote reservoir for the rear shock, followed by cleaning and fitting the exhaust.

 

The exhaust was not looking good when I first got the bike and as soon as I got it home I had a go at polishing it. I'd figured that cleaning chrome is normally a nice quick win. It had definitely got a lot better but I wasn't happy with it.

 

This is what it looked like AFTER that initial clean.

 

 

I don't know what the best technique is for this sort of job but I went through a few stages this morning.

 

First was the aggressive part : some ultra fine wire wool lubricated with metal polish. This took a long time as I focussed on one small area at a time. I wouldn't normally choose wire wool but the metal polish by itself just hadn't done the job.

 

It certainly created a mess as I did it!

 

 

However, it did seem to really help with getting rid of most of the pitting and make it look better. But it also left the surface looking a little dull - as you'd expect with wire wool

 

I then moved on to using an electric polisher with a coarse pad and more metal polish. This did quite a good job of bringing back some shine and I then finished it off with some traditional bodywork polish applied with a soft cloth.

 

I'm really pleased with the outcome and the exhaust no longer lets the rest of the bike down.

 

 

Tomorrow I hope to replace the fluid in the front brakes and refit the battery - at which point I'll be ready for the final phase of the fairings.

[Hairsy]

Short day today but a significant one.

 

First was to adjust the gear shifter. I noticed yesterday in one of the pictures that the angle didn't look right and, sure enough, when I stood over the bike and put my foot on the footpeg it was obvious that the shifter was too low. Quick adjustment and it should now be fine.

 

Then on to replacing the front brake fluid. Like the rear, the fluid wasn't too discoloured but I don't know when it was last changed and it's not worth skimping on. 

 

Then gave the front calipers a final clean up with autosol.

 

 

 

Next was the airbox. This wasn't actually too dirty but I gave it a quick cleanup which it least blackened it up a bit.

 

 

Fitted the airbox, including properly clipping on a hose that attaches to the lower side. The clip hadn't been attached when I first disassembled the bike, probably because it was quite fiddly. Like so many of these things though, the important thing is to have the mindset that fiddly doesn't mean difficult. It just means that the main tool is patience.

 

Final thing was to put the freshly charged battery in place. Quick test that dash lights came on which was all good. However, front brake is not lighting the brake light and the rear is slightly out of adjustment. Will look to sort those out tomorrow.

 

But, for now, the bike is off the stands and looking almost bike-like.

 

[Hairsy]

And a very minor update - the brake light problems were annoying me so I adjusted the rear. 30 second job.

 

Then I investigated the front. I started at the brake light and worked back, quickly finding that the switch wasn't sending anything. I removed the switch, initially expecting it to have failed. However, upon removal I could immediately see that the contacts were green with oxidisation. This gave me optimism for a free fix. As I previously mentioned, I've got a bit of a thing about cleaning all electrical connectors whenever I get to them but I'd missed one - the front brake light switch. Mainly because it's all but invisible and I had no reason to access it.

 

So I cleaned up the blades with a file, sprayed both sides of the connectors with contact cleaner and reinstalled everything.

 

And I now have a full suite of brake lights. If only all of the niggles had been that easy.

Edited February 29 by Hairsy

[Hairsy]

On 09/01/2024 at 11:46, Fozzie said:

You've got the best bodywork colours in my view, so that will really help sell it when it comes to that time.

 

Somewhat delayed in responding to this - but thank you.

 

Do you, or does anyone else, know the name of the colour scheme? I want to get a touch up pen for the metallic orange and it's difficult to search for a paint code when you don't know the name of the colour scheme. Unfortunately the colour sticker on the bike only has the colour for a metallic grey - which I guess is the darker part of the colour scheme.

 

EDIT : A Facebook group has come up with the answer so, in case anyone is reading this in the future, the colour is Honda Candy Blaze Orange. Code YR-196C.

 

Today I gave all the bodywork panels a thorough clean. I'd never really looked at them and although they're not too bad, I think they could be improved - hence seeing if I can track down a touch up pen.

 

This is the colour scheme (picture from before I started working on it);

 

Edited March 1 by Hairsy

[RideWithStyles]

you mist be confident to post the pic its meant to look like before...looking forward to it.

[Hairsy]

A mixed day today.

 

First, the bracket for the front fairing had a bit of rust on it. It's completely hidden but it was annoying me. I wish these things didn't bother me but they do - so I gave it a coat of hammerite.

 

 

I then gave the front fairing a thorough clean. I removed the headlight and indicators completely and cleaned them up, including their fixings.

 

The front fairing had what I thought was some old sticker residue. I took a photo to enable a before and after picture and then realised that it's marked 'datatag'. I removed it anyway as it was a mess.

 

 

Then I briefly took the bike outside into a brief moment of sunshine and took some nice clear under-fairing shots which I'll use when I advertise the bike.

 

Then back inside and fitted the front fairing.

 

 

The bodywork is not perfect but I want to get it as good as it can be. So when I spotted a scratch, I decided to give it 10 minutes of effort and that improved it nicely.

 

 

Next was to get the bike started again just to make sure everything is good before I move onto the final bits of bodywork.

 

Before doing this, I had to fit the new petcock to replace the one that was leaking.

 

 

It's very nice to be able to pick up the tank without getting covered in fuel.

 

I fitted the tank and connected it up and started the bike which was great.

 

However, I noticed two problems that I now have to add to my list.

 

Firstly, there's a small blow from cylinder 4's exhaust gasket.

 

Secondly, the rev counter is again being intermittent.

 

So I ended the day's work there - as I come to terms with the fact that the home straight, that I thought I was on, has couple more awkward bends in it.

 

 

 

 

[Hairsy]

Giving some thought to the challenges presented by yesterday, I need to be able to apply plenty of heat around the exhaust studs. Apart from my wife’s kitchen blowtorch and an electric heatgun, I don’t have anything that will provide the sort of heat I want.

 

Having looked at the price of butane torches, they’re a lot more expensive than I was expecting for what, I assume, is just a trigger mechanism.

 

I may be able to borrow one but it would be nice to get my own, even though it won’t get a lot of use.

 

Can anyone guide me on what I need to be looking for in a torch and perhaps recommend a budget option that will help me with removing my headers? It will only get very occasional use.

 

Thank you.

[Ian Frog]

Hi you might like to try this?

I got it as I couldnt justify the cost of the brand named one and it has been great.

Cheers

Ian

[Nick the wanderer]

Toolstation seems to be as good as most places. Propane mix, propane is hotter than butane. What do you think is expensive? Be super super careful with exhaust studs, the are going to be the rustiest thing yet and are partial to breaking.

https://www.toolstation.com/gosystem-auto-start-blow-torch/p92494

[Hairsy]

Thanks for the suggestions. I don’t really know what expensive is but my first searches threw up costs of around £75+ which was just more than I expected. 
 

All tips are welcome. Based on early research, my plan is …

- wire brushing to remove surface rust

- 2 or 3 days of applying penetrating fluid

- a few heat cycles with plenty of hammering along the way plus spraying penetrating fluid

- heat and try to remove with a short ratchet arm so that I can’t apply too much torque

- repeat as needed if it’s still too tight

 

Sound OK?

[Old-codger]

If you can clean around the stud and use plus gas spray over a few days between heat cycles dont force it as you said. Give the stud a tweak clockwise this can break the bond. Before the thread is completely knackered if you can beg borrow or steal and arc welder, weld a nut onto the stud this sudden extreme heat can help break the grip of the stud on the cylinder. When the stud starts to move stop and check it is moving and not sheering off, if it moved wind it back in a fraction then go again hopefully a bit further this time. It looks like you have plenty of patience so slow and steady and hopefully it will come out. Good luck.

[Nick the wanderer]

Looking at the rust on the rest of the bike it's going to be ten fold on the exhaust studs. In an ideal world you may be able to just nip up the collar and tighten the gasket, job done. They may have been off recently, you may get lucky.  Are you planning just doing the one? You won't be able to get the gasket out without taking the whole thing off. 

I sound all doom and gloom l know, I've been bitten by these before. If you snap a stud you'll wish you just went full disclosure at sale time. Think rear hugger tight.

[Hairsy]

3 hours ago, Nick the wanderer said:

Looking at the rust on the rest of the bike it's going to be ten fold on the exhaust studs. In an ideal world you may be able to just nip up the collar and tighten the gasket, job done. They may have been off recently, you may get lucky.  Are you planning just doing the one? You won't be able to get the gasket out without taking the whole thing off. 

I sound all doom and gloom l know, I've been bitten by these before. If you snap a stud you'll wish you just went full disclosure at sale time. Think rear hugger tight.

 

You're asking all the same questions that I am! I need to get a proper look at it first which I'll do tomorrow. I do have a wildly optimistic hope that it'll tweak up but I tend not to be quite that fortunate!

 

The headers are in fairly good nick - I doubt they're original so that gives me a little optimism. But that may turn out to be short lived.

 

And, I guess you're right, full disclosure at sale is an option. It really is a very small blow and I guess some owners might just tolerate it. But I know it would bother me if I owned the bike so I'd certainly like to solve it if I can.

 

We'll see how things pan out.

 

Thanks for the suggestions - it's all appreciated.

[oldgrump]

Hi @Hairsy, looking at photo's you look like you have the original nuts holding the exhaust on, and if they are then the nuts are long 15 - 20mm if i remember correctly and the studs are 8mm in the head,  and 7mm on nut end!!

I also mainly use this for exhaust studs instead of heat!!

Europarts sell it. 

Good spray with this,  it's a bit messy but done loads of studs  with it. 

 

[Hairsy]

Never heard of that - looks like a really interesting product. Maybe I try heat and, if that fails, then cold. Or vice-versa. 

 

From what I can see, it will work best if I can get the cold focussed onto the stud rather than the nut. I'll have a think tomorrow after I've taken a proper look. Whatever happens, I'm not going to start getting physical with it until it's had a few days of penetrating fluid to start things off.

 

The nature of forums (and other face to face advice that I'm seeking) is that I'll get different advice from different people. Which means inevitably I won't follow everyone's advice. I hope no-one will be offended by this. I'm grateful to anyone who takes the time to share their own experience and make suggestions.

[Hairsy]

Well in an extremely rare instance of good fortune, when I started investigating the nuts I found a loose one. Took it out, cleaned up threads, torqued it up to spec and problem solved!

 

Amazing how much we can panic and assume the worst. I'm glad I didn't go and invest in a load of tools - I celebrated by giving the garage a good hoover!

 

Family activities are taking priority so nothing more today. But, as you'd expect, I'm quite happy!

Edited March 4 by Hairsy

[oldgrump]

22 minutes ago, Hairsy said:

Well in an extremely rare instance of good fortune, when I started investigating the nuts I found a loose one. Took it out, cleaned up threads, torqued it up to spec and problem solved!

 

Amazing how much we can panic and assume the worst. I'm glad I didn't go and invest in a load of tools - I celebrated by giving the garage a good hoover!

 

Family activities are taking priority so nothing more today. But, as you'd expect, I'm quite happy!

Nice one, They do have a habit of coming loose once the gaskets bed down, takes a few years, just done a Honda cb750f which had lost one of the nuts!! hence why I said they were long nuts, and like you just torqued them back up!

[Nick the wanderer]

An ideal world job, they do happen..

[Hairsy]

Well it was a short lived celebration.

 

I moved onto the tacho this afternoon which has been reading intermittently. Sometimes it reads nothing. Sometimes it reads absolutely max revs and sometimes it works fine. I was really hoping to quickly find a dirty connection or broken wire but sadly not that simple.

 

The bike runs well so I think it's safe to say that the ignition itself is working well from the Ignition Control Module. That module also sends out the tacho pulse. There's good continuity from the module connector through to the relevant part of the circuit board where the rev counter picks up the signal.

 

There's also an ignition +ve feed to the tacho. That has good voltage when the ignition is turned on.

 

Finally, there's an earth going to the tacho. That earth is shared by the instrument lighting - which is working fine. However I will trace that back tomorrow to its source tomorrow just to check it - but I doubt that's the problem.
 

So I took the tacho off and cleaned up the connections on the circuit board. You can see in the second picture that they don't look great but, unfortunately, when I put it back on the bike and connected it up there was no improvement.

 

 

So I think I'm left with two likely suspects - the ICM or the tacho itself. As I understand it, to test the ICM I need a multimeter that can read Peak Voltage. I don't have one but I have got a schematic for a module that I could make to allow my standard multimeter to read a peak voltage (it uses a capacitor to build up voltage from the source and then you measure the voltage at the capacitor).

 

If the ICM is producing a good voltage (I believe it should be >10.2) then the problem is likely to be the tacho. If it's lower than that then it's the ICM.

 

I fear this is going to eat further into my pretty much non existent remaining budget. But it needs doing.

 

However, if anyone has any further bright ideas then let me know. The intermittent nature of the problem makes me think there must be something loose but I just can't figure out what more I can test. And I can't really fiddle with the tacho once it's connected to the bike because there isn't any space.

[Nick the wanderer]

I'm no bright spark with the lecky stuff so pinch of salt with whatever I say here.

Isn't rust your problem again here? Does the power not run through the pretty pink flat cable thingies and connect to whatever via the rusted washers? you can see where someone has tried cleaning them in the past? 

[RideWithStyles]

might as well!

 electricial cleaner, then a lightest coat of electrical/silicone grease protection on parts youuve cleaned up.

[Hairsy]

I've gone over all that corrosion and sorted it. There's good connectivity through those screws that provide the connection to the tacho underneath.

 

I took it all apart again this morning and sprayed some contact cleaner into the coils of the motor that moves the needle. I connected the bare instruments to the bike. It started with some erroneous readings but after a short time it settled into working well. I left it for a few minutes and all was as it should be.

 

 

In a good mood, I put the instruments back into their casing and fitted them. Started the bike again and ... no reading! After a while it kicked back into life but it's not quite right.

 

So I'm fairly sure that it's the tacho itself. I've taken a voltage reading from the signal wire and it averages at around 1.3 at idle and increases with revs. While this type of reading doesn't give the precision I want, I'm fairly confident that this is OK. Those readings are the same whether the tacho happens to be working at that stage or not.

 

I'm popping over to see a friend who is a tool supplier to the trade in a moment as he may have a proper peak voltage meter. That would allow me to have more confidence that the ICM is OK.

 

Where there's mechanical movement, as is the case with the little motor that drives the needle, a bit more operation might allow the contact cleaner to do its job and bring it back to life. After all, the bike was left sitting for 3-4 years. I don't know whether the motor has brushes - if it does then there's even more likelihood that the combination of a bit of use and the contact cleaner will sort it out.

 

Alternatively, I bite the bullet and get replacement part(s). A full set of instruments will cost me over £100 and would mean a mileage change on the bike. I don't really like that as it will then call into the question the integrity of the mileage. That's already complicated by the fact that the mileage counts in km and one or two of the MoTs have incorrectly recorded the odometer as miles (the speedo face has been replaced to show mph).

 

A better option would probably be just a second hand replacement tacho - it should be possible to find one so I think that's the option I'll pursue. I just get nervous about buying sensitive parts that someone else has hacked off a donor bike!

 

The question is whether I do it now or try riding the bike for a while and see whether the contact cleaner on the moving parts does its job.

Edited March 5 by Hairsy

[Nick the wanderer]

How do you tell if a motor is brushed or brushless?

 

 

Check Wire Count

Brushed motors usually have two wires, a positive and a negative, for power supply. In contrast, brushless motors typically have three or more wires due to the more complex electronic control required for rotation.28 Aug 2023

[Hairsy]

Thanks for that info. Unfortunately the motor is connected directly to the PCB and has a load of plastic housing around it so I just can't see.

 

To be honest, I doubt it's brushed as it must need a significant level of precision and I'm not sure a brushed motor has that. But I don't actually know

 

I went to see my tool supplier friend and he didn't have anything that would give me a peak reading - and most of his stock was out on the van doing the rounds.

 

However, as I've been able to see that the output from the ICM is consistent whether or not the tacho happens to be working at that time, I'm pretty confident that the problem is the tacho. With that in mind, I'm going to try to get hold of a replacement second hand tacho at a good price. If it turns out to be expensive then I may wait and see whether the current one becomes less intermittent life after some usage - but I'd be happier if I could replace it.

 

And while I'm waiting, I'm now starting work on getting the fairings as good as they can be. They're used with some previous crack repairs but I think they're still going to look good - certainly not worth replacing. There's also a crack that hasn't yet been repaired so I'll need to sort that out.

Edited March 5 by Hairsy