Engine cuts out regularly - Suzuki Van Van (RV125)

[jayabee3]

Hi

Does anybody elses Van Van just intermittently cut out while they're riding?  It's really irritating, I've taken it to the garage for repair 5 times now, and they haven't managed to fix it...  It's in now.  I hope they can fix it this time..  I just wondered whether anyone has any ideas, even about what could be the cause, because my garage obviously can't find the cause of it.. It's an 09 reg.  I believe I am the second owner.  I've owned it since 2013 and I am based in South East London (Bermondsey).. Even any garage recommendations in my area that may be able to help, because if the current garage can't fix it this time around, maybe I should take it somewhere else?

 

Hope I can get some ideas/advice from here.

 

Look forward to hearing...

 

Thanks

jay

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

The Van Van is a very simple bike so it really shouldn't be hard to sort out.

 

More information is needed to get an idea what it might be.

 

Any sign of lights on the instrument panel when it cuts out? A 2009 Van Van will be fuel injected so a problem with the engine management should throw a fault code. It can be read using a paper clip to bridge the terminals in the diagnostic port.

 

When it cuts out will it restart? If not what is happening when you press the starter?

 

A lot of Van Vans get stolen and the ignition barrel is nearly always replaced afterwards. But for cost reasons they usually fit a carb barrel instead of the FI barrel as it is much cheaper. Random cutting out may be due to a bad contact in the barrel. Check if yours has the same key for the tank and the ignition. Different keys usually means it's had a replacement barrel.

 

Check the sidestand switch. If that is sticking it will kill the ignition. Also check the clutch switch.

 

Has yours got the original exhaust? They don't like aftermarket systems.

 

If it is spinning on the starter but not firing does the exhaust smell of unburned petrol?

 

Always worth fitting a new spark plug to be on the safe side. They do tend to eat them quicker than some bikes.

Edited December 25, 2020 by Mississippi Bullfrog

[fastbob]

Excellent advice so far . My only question is , what kind of Garage fails to diagnose a simple case of non running on a single cylinder bike given five attempts ? I hope they aren't charging money for this non existent service . 

[jayabee3]

Thank you Bullfrog.  I will pass those suggestions along to the garage..  It does usually restart when I restart it..  It has thrown a problem light before.  The garage told me to start using the liquid for the fuel injection in with the petrol every second time I fill up with petrol.  The light hasn't come on since.  I have the same key to fill up as to start with..  They replaced the exhaust last week as said that would cure the problem; they said it was due to exhaust being clogged up due to constant "town" riding at low speeds.  It didn't fix it, so they put my old exhaust back on..  Then on the fourth time in they said there was a valve stuck in the engine so they fixed it & think that will have sorted the problem.. again doesn't seem to have fixed it, so now it's in for the fifth time.

 

Thanks again for suggestions.

[onesea]

The problem with diagnostics is knowing how it cuts out. When it cuts out etc.

Is it when changing gear? On a long straight? Hot weather cools weather?

It's it getting more frequent?

How did it start after? Immediately? After cooling? 

Totally Intermittent faults sound to me electrical but need not be.

[Stu]

Clogged exhaust due to town riding!! 

 

You need to find a different garage as that is bollocks 

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

The garage are being idiots. Find somewhere else. Get the fault codes read as if the FI light came on there will be a code logged. From memory there is an occasional issue with the TPS sensor which a few owners had issues with.

[Guest]

Even a London gridlock, wouldn't clog the exhaust.

[skyrider]

12 hours ago, jayabee3 said:

Thank you Bullfrog.  I will pass those suggestions along to the garage..  It does usually restart when I restart it..  It has thrown a problem light before.  The garage told me to start using the liquid for the fuel injection in with the petrol every second time I fill up with petrol.  The light hasn't come on since.  I have the same key to fill up as to start with..  They replaced the exhaust last week as said that would cure the problem; they said it was due to exhaust being clogged up due to constant "town" riding at low speeds.  It didn't fix it, so they put my old exhaust back on..  Then on the fourth time in they said there was a valve stuck in the engine so they fixed it & think that will have sorted the problem.. again doesn't seem to have fixed it, so now it's in for the fifth time.

 

Thanks again for suggestions.

have you tried using another garage ?

[WD-40]

Just as a general rule if it cuts out suddenly with no warning, as if you had pressed the kill switch I'd be thinking spark related electrical problem. If it's a more gradually splutter and then dies, probably fuel related. I would get an inline spark tester and the next time it cuts out check if it has spark. You can get them for a few pounds on ebay. They let you test the spark without removing the spark plug.

[jayabee3]

Thanks all.  If they can't fix it this time around based on some of the suggestions from here, then I guess I will try somewhere else....  Thanks again.

[jayabee3]

On 25/12/2020 at 21:58, onesea said:

The problem with diagnostics is knowing how it cuts out. When it cuts out etc.

Is it when changing gear? On a long straight? Hot weather cools weather?

It's it getting more frequent?

How did it start after? Immediately? After cooling? 

Totally Intermittent faults sound to me electrical but need not be.

I'll try another garage as it's still not fixed.  After picking it up from the garage, yes it now seems more frequent.  If I had to pinpoint to when it happens, it seemed to be when slowing down, then changing down gear..  It starts immediately when I restart it.

 

I gave the garage the list of suggestions from here mainly the ones from bullfrog..  They said "it's not showing any fault codes.. Everything else on the bike is fine, so it must be the fuel injection at fault and the fix would be to replace the throttle body."  They said they'd need another bike with same throttle body to test it in the first instance to prove that the fuel injection is the problem.  If they did replace the throttle body he gave me the costs of £571.42 part and £80 labour...

 

I will take it somewhere else later this week for a second opinion..

[WD-40]

Sounds like they are trying to get rid of you so they quoted a massive bill. Are there any van van specific forums that you could ask on? It could be a common problem on them

[skyrider]

2 hours ago, jayabee3 said:

I'll try another garage as it's still not fixed.  After picking it up from the garage, yes it now seems more frequent.  If I had to pinpoint to when it happens, it seemed to be when slowing down, then changing down gear..  It starts immediately when I restart it.

 

I gave the garage the list of suggestions from here mainly the ones from bullfrog..  They said "it's not showing any fault codes.. Everything else on the bike is fine, so it must be the fuel injection at fault and the fix would be to replace the throttle body."  They said they'd need another bike with same throttle body to test it in the first instance to prove that the fuel injection is the problem.  If they did replace the throttle body he gave me the costs of £571.42 part and £80 labour...

 

I will take it somewhere else later this week for a second opinion..

i would go elswhere at that price too 

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

15 hours ago, WD-40 said:

Sounds like they are trying to get rid of you so they quoted a massive bill. Are there any van van specific forums that you could ask on? It could be a common problem on them

There is a Van Van forum, I've forgotten my username and password for it but there's information on there about a problem with the FI system that causes cutting out as you describe. It can be fixed without replacing the throttle body if I remember right.

 

It's the kind of forum you need to be a member of to view. There's also a Facebook group that is worldwide so join that and ask on there. 

 

Or even just try a Suzuki dealership.

[WD-40]

There's a used throttle body on ebay for £65. Might be worth a try

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/suzuki-vanvan-rv125-throttle-body-tpi-efi-injection-fuel-pipe-07-16/254755190546?hash=item3b5097b712:g:HtUAAOSwLNBe1pxd

 

[jayabee3]

7 hours ago, Mississippi Bullfrog said:

There is a Van Van forum, I've forgotten my username and password for it but there's information on there about a problem with the FI system that causes cutting out as you describe. It can be fixed without replacing the throttle body if I remember right.

 

It's the kind of forum you need to be a member of to view. There's also a Facebook group that is worldwide so join that and ask on there. 

 

Or even just try a Suzuki dealership.

Yes I found https://suzukivanvan.forumotion.com/login and registered but I think I'm waiting for them to approve me before I can post or view..

Thanks

[jayabee3]

I have another question, should I tell the other garage that I go to tomorrow what the first garage said, or just see what they diagnose themselves?...

[Tiggie]

I'd lean towards letting them come to their own conclusions. 

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

I agree - from what you've said I don't think the first place had any idea about the Van Van. Better to let them start from scratch. The Van Van forum is a bit odd how it works but it's worth being a member as there are folk on there who have run them for years and know pretty much all there is to know about them. I never had any problem with mine. I only sold it because I needed to do motorway travelling and needed something bigger. For the rural roads I have to ride now the Van Van would actually be a better bike.

[jayabee3]

3 hours ago, WD-40 said:

There's a used throttle body on ebay for £65. Might be worth a try

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/suzuki-vanvan-rv125-throttle-body-tpi-efi-injection-fuel-pipe-07-16/254755190546?hash=item3b5097b712:g:HtUAAOSwLNBe1pxd

 

Thanks.  That's a good find.  I wonder why they'd sell it so cheaply when a new one is £571.42...

[Bianco2564]

2 hours ago, jayabee3 said:

I have another question, should I tell the other garage that I go to tomorrow what the first garage said, or just see what they diagnose themselves?...

I'd be inclined to tell them the whole story, no point in them covering the same ground and charging you for a 2nd time for something that doesn't work.

[WD-40]

56 minutes ago, jayabee3 said:

Thanks.  That's a good find.  I wonder why they'd sell it so cheaply when a new one is £571.42...

It's a used part so I guess that's what they think it's worth. There's no mention of the mileage of the bike that it came off so I'd ask that if you're thinking of buying it.

 

It's an interesting design. There's no fuel pump in the tank. Instead the injector and fuel pump are combined into one unit. If you bought that ebay part you'd be getting a throttle body, an injector, a fuel pump, an intake air pressure sensor, a throttle position sensor, an intake air temperature sensor and an idle speed control valve. http://rv125.com/Manuels/Manuel atelier RV125K7 (eng).pdf

[jayabee3]

30 minutes ago, Bianco2564 said:

I'd be inclined to tell them the whole story, no point in them covering the same ground and charging you for a 2nd time for something that doesn't work.

Yeh that's what I started to think... Thanks

[jayabee3]

16 hours ago, Mississippi Bullfrog said:

I agree - from what you've said I don't think the first place had any idea about the Van Van. Better to let them start from scratch. The Van Van forum is a bit odd how it works but it's worth being a member as there are folk on there who have run them for years and know pretty much all there is to know about them. I never had any problem with mine. I only sold it because I needed to do motorway travelling and needed something bigger. For the rural roads I have to ride now the Van Van would actually be a better bike.

How long does the Van Van forum take to approve?  I still can’t view or post anything...