Planning or no planning ?

[curlylegend]

I'm interested in peoples' opinions on this.  How many of you will plan out say a 10 day tour to the very last detail. Routes mapped out, rest and meal stops targeted, camp sites or hotels booked in advance ?

Or the other way of doing it is to just head off in a general direction and stop and eat when hungry and sleep at the side of the road when tired ? Or just search about at the end of the day for accommodation ?

How many of you do the belt and braces thing, carrying a tent etc but booking into a hotel if wet or cold or no campsites available ? Who travels with the kitchen sink and who travels with hardly any more than the contents of their pockets ?

How many of you will use motorways/autoroutes to get as far as possible in the time available, or who avoids motorways/autoroutes like the plague ? 

Who scrupulously checks routes to make sure they're going to be open and to avoid any unsurfaced roads.  And what about the latest plague, ULEZ areas ?

And what about satnav, smartphones or paper maps and memory ?

This is my luggage for a 10 day tour of Europe, the only thing I've added is an electric tyre inflator.

Let me know how you travel and how you organise it..

[Gerontious]

55 minutes ago, curlylegend said:

I'm interested in peoples' opinions on this.  How many of you will plan out say a 10 day tour to the very last detail. Routes mapped out, rest and meal stops targeted, camp sites or hotels booked in advance ?

 

You could do that, and in fact only this summer a lot of people did. People who went to Switzerland. and there were people who went to the Picos. had it all planned down to the minute. everything booked and paid for.

 

They arrived and so did the rain. and more rain. and every day. rain. This year was particularly bad for summer storms.. and not the usual isolated storms that come and quickly go.

 

maybe.. not bother with all that. maybe, have a plan B. so if the conditions are bad you can just up-sticks and go someplace else. Or go somewhere else entirely to avoid bad weather.. or a really bad heatwave (which can be just as bad)

 

Im away in June. so far I have nothing set in stone aside from visiting a grave. might do that going or as part of the return. Its just 90 miles from the tunnel so I have options. Might head east into Germany. or south into France. I don't know. And probably will not know until the last couple of days before the off.

 

As the days and weeks go by in the lead-up I might come across something and just decide to go and see it. could be anything, anywhere. Did that once 10 years ago... something half remembered from a geography lesson. I decided it would be my goal and so it was. the fun was getting to it and back again. every day made up as I went along. it was this:

 

 

The only planning Ive done so far for this year is filling two folders on my desktop with routes in Germany and routes in the South of France and the Pyrenees.  thats it. I might add Slovenia to that nearer the time. because I would like to go there again and its always a good idea to have options.

 

All thats uppermost in my head as of today is renewing my passport and booking the tunnel. there is no need whatsoever for me to do anything more than that aside from checking nearer the time that my bike is fit for purpose. And in the last few days kinda nail down where im going to head once Im off the train at calais.

 

Phone. Sat Nav. Camping gear. and the doings to make coffee. Away for a fortnight so packing for a week. And my middle rest day - on the Sunday I will avail myself of the campsite launderette and wash/dry everything so I have clean clothes for week 2. Eating out or Al fresco meals bought from the nearest Lidl or Aldi/Hofer. I can't be doing with cooking.

Edited December 27, 2023 by Gerontious

[husoi]

I have spent almost 10yrs planning a trip to the Algarve to the last detail.

Nothing went to plan except the ferry.

And were one of the worst holidays ever thanks to my ex

 

Then I use the same spreadsheet to plan the holidays to Croatia.

Fixed days were ferry from Hull to Rotterdam and back and the superb camping site near split.

Everything else was decided during breakfast in the morning.

Only plan from the day before was the visit to Zagreb as it is a 6hr ride.

The best holidays in a very long time 

 

In conclusion, yes plan your tour.

Expect that it will not go to plan and enjoy the improvise that will guide you to new unknown places and people.

[S-Westerly]

Book ferry or tunnel as appropriate andhave a final destination in mind. If visiting family this will be fixed; if not it may change subject to weather or whim. Maybe book a hotel for first night as I don't camp if on bike. After that random chance of hotels. Stayed in somegood and some less so. If there's something I want to see I'll go and see it. If there's a  particular route I want to ride I'll ride it. All very much random chance particularly when I'm on my own which is usual.

Edited December 28, 2023 by S-Westerly

[Steve_M]

Plans are useless, planning is essential.

 

We book ferries, so setting start and end dates. We designate an approximate area for the tour and head that way, the tour route from that point gets determined by the weather.

 

For example, in 2022 we booked ferries to and from Rotterdam, intending to head down to around Grenoble, across Switzerland and on to the Dolomites before returning via Austria and Germany. An exceptional early cold snap caused numerous passes to be closed so we spent time across the south of the French Alps where the weather was more clement. Following our usual practice of determining the following day’s Route each evening and, around 3pm each day using booking.com to find a hotel somewhere around our expected destination. 

 

Our eventual route  which I would never plan as a route in advance.

 

As @Gerontious pointed out, there are too many things that can disrupt a detailed plan so, for us, flexibility is the key.

[Copycat73]

every thing gets chucked into the back of a mk7 3.5t transit .. so luggage  is whatever .. 

eurotunnel is booked along with hotels .. both stopover and final destination .. 

And what about the latest plague, ULEZ areas ? ....  i got an app. on one of me big phones .. and a sticker that identifies the class of vehicle ..

other than that lots of route options and destinations on Garmin Basecamp .. in a windows laptop..

 if it rains take the van .. if it rains off the the train .. so what.. 

 

gettin of the dfds .. Ijmuiden .. it rained so hard the wipers couldn't cope whilst we were standin in line for passport control .. poor sods in front got soaked .. 20 minutes later it was glorious sunshine .. lol..  

[Pie man]

Just book the outgoing and return crossings, either chunnel or ferry. I'll decide closer to the date where I will be going and whether or not to camp or book accommodation. Phone and Sat nav, no laptop/media pad or action cameras. Always travel as light as possible. I have the Crit air sticker, but that's about it. 

 

 

[RideWithStyles]

Plan it to a rough guide but always try to factor in shite happens or foreign bs as best as web knowledge can factor in.

[rob m]

Have an idea of where you want to go and plan loosely around that I’d say. I’m away on the 19th May to Spain, the only thing that is certain is that I’m on a ferry to Santander from Plymouth and that I’m going to the MotoGP at Catalunya the following weekend. I’ve already bought the tickets. Then I’d like to cross the Pyrenees into France but no idea what routes we’re taking after that. I imagine it’ll probably be home via the Eurotunnel but I haven’t bought a return ticket, I’ll do that while over there. We’ll just keep an eye on the weather and be guided by that. Got a quite a few GPX files that can be cobbled together at short notice but I’m not planning a route, we’re going to keep it free to choose at the start of each day. We’ll look for places to stay late afternoon/early evening through booking.com or air bnb with a washing machine as I’m only taking a week’s worth of clothes. 
 

The thing is, me and my mate are really chaotic and can’t plan to save our lives but I don’t think that’s a bad thing, sense of adventure and all that. When we rode to Spain in 2016 we didn’t use a single gpx file and it all worked out fine. 

[curlylegend]

So the consensus seems to be ride light and have a plan B, and a plan C too.

And yes, it is nowadays much easier to dodge bad weather. or at least mitigate it. Sat Navs and smart arse phones seem to be the minimum requirements. Is everybody comfortable plotting out a Plan B or Plan C on a smartphone at short notice ?  

And it seems a few of you will book a first night's accommodation and wing it from there on. What if you're in a bad signal area and can't raise Booking.com ?  Anyone ever been caught out like that ?

31 minutes ago, rob m said:

When we rode to Spain in 2016 we didn’t use a single gpx file and it all worked out fine. 

So what did you do ? Follow the signs to Spain ? I'm curious.  

 

23 hours ago, Gerontious said:

I decided it would be my goal and so it was. the fun was getting to it and back again. every day made up as I went along. it was this:

Looks fantastic, where is it ?   I won't deliberately go there and I won't tell anyone else...promise.

[rob m]

1 minute ago, curlylegend said:

Anyone ever been caught out like that ?

So what did you do ? Follow the signs to Spain ? I'm curious.  

 

 

I had a Garmin Zumo, we would decide on a destination then set the sat nav to ‘no motorways’. It took us through some lovely areas of France. We knew we wanted to get to Jaca so split into 3 days. We stayed in Le Mans, Bordeaux and then to Jaca via Pau. When we were in Spain we would head out for the day and see where we ended up then use the sat nav to get back to where we were staying.

[Gerontious]

7 hours ago, curlylegend said:

Looks fantastic, where is it ?   I won't deliberately go there and I won't tell anyone else...promise.

 

Its in northern Italy. in the Apennines. Its called an Inselberg.. German for "island mountain".  The top surface is the original land surface, but because the rock is much harder than the surrounds, the surrounds eroded away and so it was left behind. Here in the UK we have a few, The Wrekin for example. Though probably the most famous in the world is Ayers Rock in Australia.

 

Anyway, its really impressive in real life and I was really chuffed to see it. Pietra di Bismantova

 

BTW, the decision to go there was as a result of everything going pear shaped. This was the year when on day one, the rain started at Peterborough and it rained every single day from Peterborough to Lake Garda. I saw nothing of the mountains in Austria and the Italian Alps. Low cloud and either rain or drizzle. day after day. So, I went to see this formation and then afterwards down to the foot of Italy. I was going to cross to Sicily. But after a few days at the foot I was so horrified by what I saw every day. That I turned around and headed up the Adriatic Coast. I did do a few touristy things. I saw Pisa. and the greek temples at Paestum. plus Vesuvius and Pompeii. Then back north and back to the rain. (sigh)

 

I had no smart phone, so these various locations were found using a computer at a campsite I stayed at. in a common room. found these various places and put them on my sat nav as POI's and then navigated between them, making the routes up as I went. avoiding motorways and tolls. all very last minute and ad hoc. There was no preparation before hand. My intention was to spend the time mostly in the Dolomites. I never saw them. Never went near them. I crossed into Italy using the Brenner pass. the old road.  The drizzle continued right to just by Riva del Garda. Ahead was blue skies - the sun came out and it was like someone opened an oven door.

 

It worked out well, once I escaped the rain. but I have no desire to ever return to the south of Italy. ever.

Edited December 29, 2023 by Gerontious

[Pie man]

18 hours ago, curlylegend said:

So the consensus seems to be ride light and have a plan B, and a plan C too.

And yes, it is nowadays much easier to dodge bad weather. or at least mitigate it. Sat Navs and smart arse phones seem to be the minimum requirements. Is everybody comfortable plotting out a Plan B or Plan C on a smartphone at short notice ?  

And it seems a few of you will book a first night's accommodation and wing it from there on. What if you're in a bad signal area and can't raise Booking.com ?  Anyone ever been caught out like that ?

 

Long before Smart phones and the ability to use Booking dot com on the fly, we would start looking for accommodation around 4pm, just rock up and ask, never fails.   

[curlylegend]

4 hours ago, Pie man said:

Long before Smart phones and the ability to use Booking dot com on the fly, we would start looking for accommodation around 4pm, just rock up and ask, never fails. 

Never fails ?  Christ you're lucky. It's failed me quite a few times.  Maybe it's me, patch over the eye, scar on the cheek hook for a hand and a waistcoat with a very popular American motorcycle club's name on the back.  Years ago, in Scotland, I did have to sleep in a graveyard, both hotels allegedly full and B&B's not answering the door.  More recently, in France, I've managed to turn up in a town hosting some damned sporting or cultural event. Then it was either Formule 1 or the bloody Hilton !

[curlylegend]

22 hours ago, Gerontious said:

It worked out well, once I escaped the rain. but I have no desire to ever return to the south of Italy. ever.

I suspect a story there ?   Might be similar to the reasons I'm not at all keen on northern Italy between Lake Garda and Turin.

[curlylegend]

23 hours ago, rob m said:

I had a Garmin Zumo, we would decide on a destination then set the sat nav to ‘no motorways’. It took us through some lovely areas of France. We knew we wanted to get to Jaca so split into 3 days. We stayed in Le Mans, Bordeaux and then to Jaca via Pau. When we were in Spain we would head out for the day and see where we ended up then use the sat nav to get back to where we were staying.

I'm still using a Garmin Zumo.  I would use that method myself.... actually I have done....but nowadays there are so many 30km speed restrictions in towns and villages with speed bumps that rival the Alps. I prefer to plot out a route to avoid as many of these as I can. I use MyRoute App on my PC  and any routes I create are available on my smart phone and downloadable onto my Zumo. 

But if the worst comes to the worst and my phone's not available I can always revert to my Zumo.

I normally carry a cheapo Android Tablet, weighs nothing and takes up no space, and use it to book accommodation at my leisure in the digs I'm in for the next evening, making sure that it has everything I need, free wi-fi, parking etc. Then I'll modify my route by putting in a few POI's and making sure I'm not going overboard with the distance or the time in the saddle.

[Mawsley]

Pants. Spare pants. Emergency pants. Cool T shirt. Two spare less Coll band T shirts. Waterproofs. 
 

Huge self inflating bed (comfort is king). Super expensive and unjustifiable to the wife tent. Sleeping bag. 
 

Credits cards. Bank cards. 
 

An idea where south is. 
 

That’s me done. 

[Steve_M]

On 28/12/2023 at 22:36, curlylegend said:

So the consensus seems to be ride light and have a plan B, and a plan C too.

And yes, it is nowadays much easier to dodge bad weather. or at least mitigate it. Sat Navs and smart arse phones seem to be the minimum requirements. Is everybody comfortable plotting out a Plan B or Plan C on a smartphone at short notice ?  

And it seems a few of you will book a first night's accommodation and wing it from there on. What if you're in a bad signal area and can't raise Booking.com ?  Anyone ever been caught out like that ?

So what did you do ? Follow the signs to Spain ? I'm curious.  

 

Looks fantastic, where is it ?   I won't deliberately go there and I won't tell anyone else...promise.

I would suggest that “ride light” translates as “ only carry essentials and required items”. What fits that criteria differs from rider to rider and tour location to tour location.
 

I will emphasise that, in my opinion,  flexibility around choosing your route is required rather than a fixed plan A, B, C or Z… Planning options - sights, places, road sections, in advance is not wasted effort even if you don’t get to them 
 

We’ve never had a significant issue with getting a signal to book hotels, though it has occasionally - rarely- meant stopping for coffee to use a cafe’s Wi-Fi. 

 

[Fiddlesticks]

3 hours ago, Steve_M said:

I would suggest that “ride light” translates as “ only carry essentials and required items”. What fits that criteria differs from rider to rider and tour location to tour location.

 Bearing this in mind, just about to buy a travel guitar.

[Pie man]

13 hours ago, curlylegend said:

Never fails ?  Christ you're lucky. It's failed me quite a few times.  Maybe it's me, patch over the eye, scar on the cheek hook for a hand and a waistcoat with a very popular American motorcycle club's name on the back.  Years ago, in Scotland, I did have to sleep in a graveyard, both hotels allegedly full and B&B's not answering the door.  More recently, in France, I've managed to turn up in a town hosting some damned sporting or cultural event. Then it was either Formule 1 or the bloody Hilton !

Yep,  it must be you 

[Pie man]

9 hours ago, Fiddlesticks said:

 Bearing this in mind, just about to buy a travel guitar.

I have taken a Ukulele with me, but we were in the Van  

[curlylegend]

10 hours ago, Pie man said:

 Bearing this in mind, just about to buy a travel guitar.

Yes, what is a travel guitar ? 

A pal of mine always travels with a harp...a jews harp.    Am I allowed to say that ?

[curlylegend]

I'm taking all this in you know.

I would like to know if I'm missing out on something, or more likely doing something daft !

 

Thanks for all your answers.

[husoi]

6 hours ago, curlylegend said:

Yes, what is a travel guitar ? 

A pal of mine always travels with a harp...a jews harp.    Am I allowed to say that ?

Maybe he's referring to a ukulele

Which by the way was invented by the Portuguese sailors as it is much smaller than the normal acoustic guitar and easier to carry on a sailing boat.

For some strange reason people in Hawaii loved it and use them a lot

 

Personally, a ukulele is like a soft version of a bagpipes. Nice to hear when you're 10 miles away but hell no close to you

[Mawsley]

13 hours ago, curlylegend said:

Yes, what is a travel guitar ?