Bigger engine but less horsepower, how?

[geofferz]

Just now, Stu

6 minutes ago, geofferz said:

Anyway personally I don't bother looking at the torque figure - it's bollocks. I rode a Harley with loads of torque but super low revs so tiny bhp. It was horrifically slow - I couldn't appreciate any of its torquey goodness, it was slow in every gear at every rpm. 

 

Bhp matters. 

Torque is not bollocks! You ride on torque you race on bhp 

A Harley is not a good comparison to be honest but then it depends on the Harley too 

Get the right bikes to compare and you can tell the difference 

The TL I had would stomp out of corners leaving all sorts of bikes but get in to the higher revs you would get reigned in 

You can't ride on torque! Because you need revs. Which means bhp. Name 2 comparative bikes where the torquey one would beat the higher bhp one anywhere on the street or track?!

[geofferz]

Just now, Mississippi Bullfrog

4 minutes ago, geofferz said:

Anyway personally I don't bother looking at the torque figure - it's bollocks. I rode a Harley with loads of torque but super low revs so tiny bhp. It was horrifically slow - I couldn't appreciate any of its torquey goodness, it was slow in every gear at every rpm. 

 

Bhp matters. 

You haven't ridden the Triumph 1200 twin. Loads of low end grunt but a relatively small bhp figure. But for passing lines of traffic on A roads the grin factor is huge. The downside is that accidentally twitch the throttle on a greasy roundabout and it gets very very interesting very very quickly. The power range is at a very usable 3000+ which makes instant acceleration in traffic a rather wonderful thing. The unwary BMW/Audi driver hears it coming, assumes it something like a Harley, thinks they won't get passed. They are wrong.

I have actually, I thought it was slow but I'm used to riding superbikes.

[Stu]

2 minutes ago, geofferz said:

You can't ride on torque! Because you need revs. Which means bhp. Name 2 comparative bikes where the torquey one would beat the higher bhp one anywhere on the street or track?!

You are missing the point! without one you don't have the other you ride on torque as that's the band of power you use all day long you race on bhp as you are constantly high in the revs 

I never said a torquey bike would beat a higher bhp bike on the street or track there is way too many variables to take in to consideration! 

Tight twisty roads are best on a bike with low down torque as you can pull harder from the apex than you can with a bike with lower torque but higher bhp the higher bhp will eventually take over but by then you are slowing down for the corner the Torquey motor would get you to a higher speed quicker than the lower torque bike! 

 

A mate of mine used to have a gsxr 750 SRAD 128bhp at the crank 59 ft-lb or torque 

At the same time I have the TL1000s 125 bhp at the crank 76 ft-lb of torque 

Both same year bikes too 

I would always pull away from him but it was never enough to leave him in a trail of dust it was just enough to get away a good 20 - 30 metres he could never real me in nor could I never leave him similar bhp yet different torque 

by the way getting on a V twin and riding it like a sports bike will never work you have to take time to learn where the power curves are and shift earlier you don't ride them in the higher revs like a sports bike you keep them lower 

It took me ages to learn the TL I was constantly hitting the rev limiter and felt like it was never moving till you look down and you're doing 140  

[Guest Swagman]

Think I’ll stick with my Fazer and just keep plodding along.

[JRH]

1 hour ago, geofferz said:

You can't ride on torque! Because you need revs. Which means bhp. Name 2 comparative bikes where the torquey one would beat the higher bhp one anywhere on the street or track?!

Without torque you will go nowhere, period.

torque gets you there, BHP keeps you going.

[Stu]

3 minutes ago, JRH said:

Without torque you will go nowhere, period.

torque gets you there, BHP keeps you going.

Thats a short version of what I was trying to say  

[Bender]

I don't know what's not to get, don't make me fetch dobbin back out 

[Tiggie]

This is just like the old days on here, anyone fancy starting a counter steering thread? 

[Bender]

2 minutes ago, Tiggie said:

This is just like the old days on here, anyone fancy starting a counter steering thread? 

Don't torque about counter steering there is no such thing 

[Tiggie]

There is but only if you use super unleaded rather than bog standard stuff 

[onesea]

27 minutes ago, JRH said:

Without torque you will go nowhere, period.

torque gets you there, BHP keeps you going.

So putting this back to horses both bellow are 1 Hp:

Race horse:  High Speed - Low weight pulling capacity - Low stamina - relatively light weight.
Could be thought of as Low Torque high speed and acceleration.

Cart Horse:  Low Speed - High weight pulling capacity - High Stamina - relatively heavy weight.
Could be thought of as High Torque Low Speed and acceleration.

I am sure there are more types of horse out there as there are bikes...  Comparing a Harley and sports bike is like comparing the above.

horses for courses?

[Bender]

10 minutes ago, onesea said:

So putting this back to horses both bellow are 1 Hp:

Race horse:  High Speed - Low weight pulling capacity - Low stamina - relatively light weight.
Could be thought of as Low Torque high speed and acceleration.

Cart Horse:  Low Speed - High weight pulling capacity - High Stamina - relatively heavy weight.
Could be thought of as High Torque Low Speed and acceleration.

I am sure there are more types of horse out there as there are bikes...  Comparing a Harley and sports bike is like comparing the above.

horses for courses?

Don't forget the most important horse of all, the draught horse, shire horses have held records for being the biggest, which is very important where beer delivery is concerned  

[fastbob]

I'm not bothered anymore . I have to say that really because I've just lost 100 hp and gained 100 cc . Still got the same castle though . ( And colour scheme , and bag ....)

Edited November 27, 2020 by fastbob

[fastbob]

And as a footnote , when this thing's on the road I'll be dropping a whopping 700 cc's but only 10 hp . It's a funny old world isn't it . 

[Marino]

4 hours ago, Bender said:

Haha ok I concede  

 

 

AlthoughSpanish, Italian, German and Danish studs were used and later studs from the orient.

And Lipizzaner is the Italian name

I'm jus waffling to cover my tracks  

 

I don't know what dobbin is in Slovenian, mind you I don't know what it is in Italian either  

Not that I know something more, I am just born near there in Croatia, 40 min from Lipica and remember going horse riding with my parents .

[skyrider]

at my time of life i dont need hyper sports bikes i just need plodder's that get me from a to b sometime 

[Marino]

Big bikes with lot of torque and hp’s are for us with small winners 

[geofferz]

14 hours ago, Marino said:

Big bikes with lot of torque and hp’s are for us with small winners 

Weiners? Yes, correct. 

[Marino]

6 minutes ago, geofferz said:

Weiners? Yes, correct. 

I could not write wieners, so it’s winners ( my keyboard is politically correct)

[dynax]

1 minute ago, Marino said:

I could not write wieners, so it’s winners ( my keyboard is politically correct)

Keep it simple and say " knobs "

[Marino]

what I come with after turning off my polite keyboard 

 

phallus 

dick (taboo, slang) 

prick (taboo, slang) 

member 

tool (taboo, slang) 

organ 

cock (taboo, slang) 

wang (US, slang)

knob (British, taboo, slang) 

chopper (British, slang) 

plonker (slang) 

dong (slang) 

winkle (British, slang) 

joystick (slang) 

pecker (US, Canadian, taboo, slang)

John Thomas (taboo, slang)

weenie (US, slang)

whang (US, slang)

tadger (British, slang)

schlong (US, slang)

pizzle (archaic, dialect) 

willie or willy (British, informal)

tockley (Australian, slang) 

[Marino]

For years I believed that Croatian language is champion in swearing and bad, rude words. But checking on English, I am amazed how many synonyms just for small piece of extra skin 

[TimR]

49 minutes ago, Marino said:

what I come with after turning off my polite keyboard 

 

phallus 

dick (taboo, slang) 

prick (taboo, slang) 

member 

tool (taboo, slang) 

organ 

cock (taboo, slang) 

wang (US, slang)

knob (British, taboo, slang) 

chopper (British, slang) 

plonker (slang) 

dong (slang) 

winkle (British, slang) 

joystick (slang) 

pecker (US, Canadian, taboo, slang)

John Thomas (taboo, slang)

weenie (US, slang)

whang (US, slang)

tadger (British, slang)

schlong (US, slang)

pizzle (archaic, dialect) 

willie or willy (British, informal)

tockley (Australian, slang) 

Intentional Pun or not 

Edited November 28, 2020 by TimR

[Marino]

5 minutes ago, TimR said:

Intentional Pun or not 

 at least someone is reading carefully 

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

1 hour ago, Marino said:

For years I believed that Croatian language is champion in swearing and bad, rude words. But checking on English, I am amazed how many synonyms just for small piece of extra skin 

Greek is pretty impressive as well.