Metropolitan Police - use of tactical contact on mopeds

[Six30]

... Yeh, but the thing about amputations and killings is that the appeals process is a bit complicated...... if you don't believe me just ask Timothy Evans or Derek Bentley.... oh, that's right, you can't. Shame, that....

 

On the other hand It's a shame that the likes of Roy whiting and Levi bellfield can appeal....

.... Somehow think you missed the point...... just hope you never get fitted up.

 

No.... I got it ..... bring back hanging .

[Guest]

Just hope it's not you being hanged, then., 'Cos nobody ever gets it wrong, do they? Either accidentally or even on purpose.

[MarkW]

I can't say I've ever been very keen on the idea of giving a bloke in a silly wig the power of life and death over his fellow humans.

[Via]

I can't say I've ever been very keen on the idea of giving a bloke in a silly wig the power of life and death over his fellow humans.

 

They wouldn't be though, it would be down to 12 people who are too stupid to get out of jury service.

[Bender]

I can't say I've ever been very keen on the idea of giving a bloke in a silly wig the power of life and death over his fellow humans.

 

They wouldn't be though, it would be down to 12 people who are too stupid to get out of jury service.

 

[mention]Via[/mention] I have done jury service and I would have happily pulled the rope/thrown the switch, we weren't all stupid but it was about 70/40 split

seriously though its a sobering experience, especially murder, not so much the case but unfortunately the thought processes of some of the jurors.

we would have given the gallows had it been available.

[ShouldKnowBetter]

Brilliant stuff!

However, how come the little scrotes can get knocked off a scooter at a reasonable pace wearing an ill fitted helmet (or no helmet), a hoody and tracky bottoms, and still get up and run away, or get up and look at the police car like “WTF?” Meanwhile I’m shitting myself about falling off in my armoured jacket and armoured trousers and £400 Shoei that I spent an hour sizing.

Anyway, sorry if I was taking it back on topic. Feel free to go back to debating the moral implications of the death penalty.

[Six30]

Just hope it's not you being hanged, then., 'Cos nobody ever gets it wrong, do they? Either accidentally or even on purpose.

 

Won't be will it , to many snowflakes to ever get the gallows brought back .

[Mickly]

I can't say I've ever been very keen on the idea of giving a bloke in a silly wig the power of life and death over his fellow humans.

 

They wouldn't be though, it would be down to 12 people who are too stupid to get out of jury service.

 

The Jury only determine guilt, the sentence is provided by the Judge ( person in a silly wig )

[Guest]

The thing about snowflakes is that if you have enough of them, they have a habit of of turning into avalanches. Just don't get in the way when they do.

[Mickly]

While I do welcome a crackdown on this kind of crime, I do have a concern about the police acting as Judge and Jury, having fallen foul of a few complete ar*eholes in police uniforms.

Also having been almost wiped out on my bike by an unmarked speeding police car jumping a junction I think they should still be brought to account for their actions if it affects innocent people, but as has been posted - that doesn’t help if you’re dead !!

[Mississippi Bullfrog]

Brilliant stuff!

However, how come the little scrotes can get knocked off a scooter at a reasonable pace wearing an ill fitted helmet (or no helmet), a hoody and tracky bottoms, and still get up and run away, or get up and look at the police car like “WTF?” Meanwhile I’m shitting myself about falling off in my armoured jacket and armoured trousers and £400 Shoei that I spent an hour sizing.

Anyway, sorry if I was taking it back on topic. Feel free to go back to debating the moral implications of the death penalty.

 

That's more relevant than you realise. You worry about falling off and damaging yourself or your kit because you have something to lose. Those led into a life of crime often get there because they have nothing to lose. The only currency they have is their cred with their mates, everything else is just transitory. Which is why talk of capital punishment is pointless. Take murder for example - the one crime more people think the death penalty would help prevent. Yet most murderers are not serial offenders nor even career criminals. Most murders are not premeditated and arise from people losing control of themselves. If you visit a prison the one group of people who are most 'normal' are those in for murder because they're basically normal people who just lost it. Capital punishment won't touch that situation.

If we want to reduce this scourge we have to go way back into why it's happening and those are big questions few people want to face up to. Not least because the solutions are expensive in terms of money and willpower and most people (including politicians) are only interested in quick fixes and easy solutions.

I feel sorry for the police who are forced to resort to this tactic because they're left to clear up the mess nobody else want to tackle. It's pointless because all they're doing is mopping up the symptoms knowing full well the real cause it being ignored.

[MarkW]

It costs about £80,000 per inmate per year to keep a murderer in prison. Let's hang them instead and give the money we save to the NHS, and then be free to assert our own moral equivalence with Saudi Arabia, Iran, Yemen and North Korea instead of being slaves to the bloody Human Rights Act. Come on snowflakes - let's make Britain great again!

[Via]

While I do welcome a crackdown on this kind of crime, I do have a concern about the police acting as Judge and Jury, having fallen foul of a few complete ar*eholes in police uniforms.

Also having been almost wiped out on my bike by an unmarked speeding police car jumping a junction I think they should still be brought to account for their actions if it affects innocent people, but as has been posted - that doesn’t help if you’re dead !!

 

There is a very simple way everyone, especially the innocent, can and being rammed off their bike and the possible consequences associated.... When that car behind flashes blue lights and turns siren on, pull over to the side of the road and stop.

[TimR]

While I do welcome a crackdown on this kind of crime, I do have a concern about the police acting as Judge and Jury, having fallen foul of a few complete ar*eholes in police uniforms.

Also having been almost wiped out on my bike by an unmarked speeding police car jumping a junction I think they should still be brought to account for their actions if it affects innocent people, but as has been posted - that doesn’t help if you’re dead !!

 

There is a very simple way everyone, especially the innocent, can and being rammed off their bike and the possible consequences associated.... When that car behind flashes blue lights and turns siren on, pull over to the side of the road and stop.

 

what could go wrong

https://www.visordown.com/news/general/vigilante-jailed-beating-motorcyclist-after-knocking-him-bike

[Via]

While I do welcome a crackdown on this kind of crime, I do have a concern about the police acting as Judge and Jury, having fallen foul of a few complete ar*eholes in police uniforms.

Also having been almost wiped out on my bike by an unmarked speeding police car jumping a junction I think they should still be brought to account for their actions if it affects innocent people, but as has been posted - that doesn’t help if you’re dead !!

 

There is a very simple way everyone, especially the innocent, can and being rammed off their bike and the possible consequences associated.... When that car behind flashes blue lights and turns siren on, pull over to the side of the road and stop.

 

what could go wrong

https://www.visordown.com/news/general/vigilante-jailed-beating-motorcyclist-after-knocking-him-bike

 

Yeah but that is the point police won't be randomly ramming motorcycles off the road they believe are thiefs, they will use the old fashion method of putting flashy lights on and making some noise. If you're not a thief pull over and have a chat.

Even if you have no mirrors and have head phones in and don't notice them they will not ram you off, if you are driving normally they will just keep following you until you stop.

Now regardless of being a thief or not if they try and pull you over and you ride off like an absolute twat putting yourself and other road users in danger then you deserve everything that happens.

[Mickly]

It’s not always the people they are after that they injure - My experience was not having flashing lights behind me.

The Police car exited a side road without stopping, there were large hedges that prevented me seeing it or the police seeing me, It was a VERY close thing.

My point is that the Police should be answerable for their actions and not given an easy ride just because they are highly trained, in fact quite the opposite, if they injure an innocent person they should have to explain why, given that they are so highly trained to avoid such incidents.

[ShouldKnowBetter]

You worry about falling off and damaging yourself or your kit because you have something to lose. Those led into a life of crime often get there because they have nothing to lose. The only currency they have is their cred with their mates, everything else is just transitory. Which is why talk of capital punishment is pointless. Take murder for example - the one crime more people think the death penalty would help prevent. Yet most murderers are not serial offenders nor even career criminals. Most murders are not premeditated and arise from people losing control of themselves. If you visit a prison the one group of people who are most 'normal' are those in for murder because they're basically normal people who just lost it. Capital punishment won't touch that situation.

If we want to reduce this scourge we have to go way back into why it's happening and those are big questions few people want to face up to. Not least because the solutions are expensive in terms of money and willpower and most people (including politicians) are only interested in quick fixes and easy solutions.

I feel sorry for the police who are forced to resort to this tactic because they're left to clear up the mess nobody else want to tackle. It's pointless because all they're doing is mopping up the symptoms knowing full well the real cause it being ignored.

 

That’s a very rational and considered perspective. You do realise this is an internet forum, right? Generally accepted protocol dictates that a ensible viewpoints have no place on internet forums, in my experience.

[Throttled]

I think it looks great fun, for the police and makes me want to come out of retirement.

[Slowlycatchymonkey]

Yes how does one join the motorcycle ram force? Looks like death defying fun.

[MarkW]

Do the general publics powers of citizens arrest extend to knocking them off? My battered old XC90 would be perfect for the job.

[onesea]

what could go wrong

https://www.visordown.com/news/general/vigilante-jailed-beating-motorcyclist-after-knocking-him-bike

 

The legal system, I agree Walden acted like an idiot. He over stepped many many marks... 6.5 years though?

The guy he knocked off was on a stolen motorbike and a known bike thief. The guy who he knocked off was out on the streets the next day looking for bikes to steal, in areas that he would not of been safe before.

I had been to a meeting with the police where they said " if your bike gets stolen report it to us, but if you want it back call these guys".

Following Walden being taken off the streets I will no longer ride my motorbike to one of our work sites because there is a good chance it will not be there at the end of shift.

It ads insult where this guy, from the same city gets 4 years less... How does that work?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/17240364.amp/

I can now no longer walk the dog on a local grass area unless it's daylight because of kids on bikes using it as a dirt track. They know they are above the law so they are not going to stop.

[Liveware Problem]

Saw it on Facebook

[SometimesSansEngine]

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I think Diane is running against most public opinion as I understand it.

I personally think there should be very strict guidelines for when this tactic is authorised, but that's the same as police pursuits in general as it stands. Make sure the guidelines are in place, train up the officers in the tactic and also when to call it off, and give them protection that as long as the guidance was followed and the contact was correctly authorised they will be covered.

[Hoggs]

All the police I know say they actively try and NOT kill people as it generates too much paperwork

[Joe85]

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I think Diane is running against most public opinion as I understand it.

I personally think there should be very strict guidelines for when this tactic is authorised, but that's the same as police pursuits in general as it stands. Make sure the guidelines are in place, train up the officers in the tactic and also when to call it off, and give them protection that as long as the guidance was followed and the contact was correctly authorised they will be covered.

 

What is meant by protection (in general, as an aside from your post)