KiwiBob Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 17 minutes ago, MikeHorton said: I think that's the same for any union/federation now. I find most that are reps only do it for their own gain etc If your not happy with your union rep than why not have a go at it yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHorton Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 17 minutes ago, KiwiBob said: If your not happy with your union rep than why not have a go at it yourself? I did for a year and saw how it as ran hence my comments! I enjoyed doing something beneficial for members and had good feed back but sometimes your fighting a losing battle with the management within the said organisation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiwiBob Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 16 minutes ago, MikeHorton said: I did for a year and saw how it as ran hence my comments! I enjoyed doing something beneficial for members and had good feed back but sometimes your fighting a losing battle with the management within the said organisation Well done for giving it a go! .. I always had great respect for my local union reps for all the time and hard work they put in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throttled Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 Always used Stenna Line to go to NI, always will. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Westerly Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 1 hour ago, KiwiBob said: If your not happy with your union rep than why not have a go at it yourself? Kind of difficult if you are deep sea to be a union rep as we are always away. Even back in the day when the UK had a significant fleet most union reps were ferrymen. Hence we never felt the union was "ours". The reps never had a clue as to how worked and always saw everything through the lens of being home every couple of days. These days even worse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 I think a lot of people seem to forget that they are the union! not the reps! The reps are the ones who go in on your behalf its all about standing together Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilM Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 Any Union is only as strong as it's membership. Coming from a closed shop background and seeing the decline in membership during recent times is heartbreaking. Not helped by the anti Union laws passed relatively recently. Reps/shop stewards are at times stuck between a rock and a hard place. Most don't see what they do behind the scenes, as for most folk the only interaction with a rep is when shits going down. (The reason shits not gone down previously may be the rep doing a good job behind the scenes) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
husoi Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 I never understood the need or usefulness of an union. I've worked in some "unionised" institutions and never saw anything good coming from them. My ex partner was at risk from being sacked because she refused to sign up to Unison and when a dispute arise with a union member, Unison couldn't care less who was right but instead made all they could to have their member job safe while my ex was at risk of loosing her job. While on a council (too embarrassing to give names) I saw the union rep working for never more than 2 hours a day (and I use working on a very loose way) while the rest he would spend reading the papers, checking personal emails and chatting to his girlfriend. I left the council because even working half asleep I would work far faster than any of them. At any point in my long working life that I wasn't happy with my conditions, I just organise my onw union and sacked the boss. Yes, I know, this is as near being TOTY as I can get Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy sugger Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 When I started work I could not take the job I applied for without joining the union, the AUEW. I argued that it was the firm employing me, not the union, so refused. In the end I compromised and joined, but on the proviso I would not take part in industrial action of any kind, unless it concerned safety issues. My 3rd year there, after a protracted issue over a wage rise, the union members agreed, across the board, to a 2.5% increase and a change to the piecework scheme, and in my role that meant I could triple my wage. Two weeks into the new wage the toolroom walked out, because the disparity in wages between them (skilled) and us (semi/unskilled) had closed too much, so we all suffered because they threw their toys out the pram They ended up with a rise, cos we could not function without the toolroom, but 6 months later the firm started laying off staff cos they could not afford the wage bill and increasing prices signed the death knell for us so everyone lost their job 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilM Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 39 minutes ago, husoi said: I never understood the need or usefulness of an union. I've worked in some "unionised" institutions and never saw anything good coming from them. My ex partner was at risk from being sacked because she refused to sign up to Unison and when a dispute arise with a union member, Unison couldn't care less who was right but instead made all they could to have their member job safe while my ex was at risk of loosing her job. While on a council (too embarrassing to give names) I saw the union rep working for never more than 2 hours a day (and I use working on a very loose way) while the rest he would spend reading the papers, checking personal emails and chatting to his girlfriend. I left the council because even working half asleep I would work far faster than any of them. At any point in my long working life that I wasn't happy with my conditions, I just organise my onw union and sacked the boss. Yes, I know, this is as near being TOTY as I can get Thats the whole point of a union. The rep will always fight for the members rights. Why would a union official care about the non union member. They haven't paid their subs and chosen to go their own way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onesea Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 The problem for unions and P&O as they have demonstrated is that there are other people from other places who will gladly work for considerably less wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHorton Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 2 hours ago, billy sugger said: When I started work I could not take the job I applied for without joining the union, the AUEW. I argued that it was the firm employing me, not the union, so refused. In the end I compromised and joined, but on the proviso I would not take part in industrial action of any kind, unless it concerned safety issues. My 3rd year there, after a protracted issue over a wage rise, the union members agreed, across the board, to a 2.5% increase and a change to the piecework scheme, and in my role that meant I could triple my wage. Two weeks into the new wage the toolroom walked out, because the disparity in wages between them (skilled) and us (semi/unskilled) had closed too much, so we all suffered because they threw their toys out the pram They ended up with a rise, cos we could not function without the toolroom, but 6 months later the firm started laying off staff cos they could not afford the wage bill and increasing prices signed the death knell for us so everyone lost their job I have happy memories of life in a toolroom did progression pressings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Westerly Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 When the deep sea fleet got butchered in the 70's and 80's the union did absolutely sweet fa for us. Even the redundancy payments were legal minimum - I saw guys with 30 years in get less payout than a Liverpool docker. It was a joke. I dropped out of the union then and only rejoined in the 90's when I went master and that is for the legal cover in the event of any incident ending up in court. My line of work was never a closed shop although it was pushed for but never got traction. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy sugger Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 2 hours ago, MikeHorton said: I have happy memories of life in a toolroom did progression pressings I'm now a qualified Power Press Setter, and my speciality is progression tools 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHorton Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 Those were the days. Hope you enjoy life in the press shop! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rennie Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 I'm in a Union, I've not long re-joined for the legal protection, but they're pretty useless I have to say 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marino Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 Seafarers unions are for seafarers navigate not more than one day from the ports. And important eu and us ports. Away from eu or us pretty much useless, especially on banana flags. In my 30+ years at sea I managed to witness that. This was always 3 world countries business and it going worst. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Westerly Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 Too true. We used to call "our" union (now NUMAST) the ferryman Union because they were the only ones who seemed to get any benefit from it. See some of the guys being laid off are in line for £100 K pay off. Soften the blow a bit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Westerly Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 P&O boss now says they may have broken the law but its alright as they'll pay compensation? Pretty sure that's not how the law generally works. You can't arbitrarily decide to break one and then say it doesn't matter cos you'll pay compensation to whoever is the victim of your transgression. Where do you draw the line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiwiBob Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 On 24/03/2022 at 13:26, S-Westerly said: P&O boss now says they may have broken the law but its alright as they'll pay compensation? Pretty sure that's not how the law generally works. You can't arbitrarily decide to break one and then say it doesn't matter cos you'll pay compensation to whoever is the victim of your transgression. Where do you draw the line? Its the way the Tories would like it to work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Westerly Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 I'm a Tory and I don't have a particular desire to sack people but if a company (and not P&O in this case) needs to let people go what are they supposed to do? Keep everybody and go bust or let some go and survive? I've been made redundant 3 times and just got on with it. And the companies I worked for weren't British so I didn't get a brass farthing in compensation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bianco2564 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 My understanding is the jobs aren't redundant, they just want to cut the wages bill? They said they were running at £100m a year loss, but could find £36m to cover redundancies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullscreenaging Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Bianco2564 said: My understanding is the jobs aren't redundant, they just want to cut the wages bill? They said they were running at £100m a year loss, but could find £36m to cover redundancies? I read that they had recently paid out over £200m in bonuses etc? So really they had made £100m in profit? Also the 100m profit they made was from the tax payer after they had received over 200m from the Gov? Typical private company getting the public to bail them out but stealing the cash. Edited March 26, 2022 by fullscreenaging 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted March 26, 2022 Author Share Posted March 26, 2022 The 200m was the parent company paying out on its profits. Ships reg in Bahamas, company registered in Jersey company owned by dubai based company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullscreenaging Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 3 hours ago, Bender said: The 200m was the parent company paying out on its profits. Ships reg in Bahamas, company registered in Jersey company owned by dubai based company. What profits though? Running at 100m loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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